[Deanos]

Here's out current Sponsor List. As Josh stated, if they want a dedicated forum on the board, they must apply to also be a vendor. Currently, only 2 of those sponsors actively advertise their stock in the current Vendor Sales forum.

[Chiefmcfuz]

Quote: Originally Posted by michael stern First of all, I'm glad this vendor situation will get more organized. I applaud the effors. I also agree that it is the seller's responsibility to INFORM potential customers of requirements of the items they are selling. Ultimately, however, it is the buyers discretion to accept or reject the seller's advise. If a buyer askes to buy a sohal tang, for instance. The seller should inquire as to tank size and other inhabitants. If the buyer says I have a 55 gallon, with 3 other tangs, but this will be my last tang until I upgrade in 2012, the seller should make all reasonable efforts to discourage the purchase. If the buyer persists, I don't believe it's the seller's responsibility to police potential customers. This is America. You cannot forbid a customer from buying. JMO

I think MR is holding it's vendors to a higher standard and it is that higher standard that makes MR the great community it is. To put some responsibility in the vendors hands is extremely admirable. If you want no responsibility open a Petco. Those are good rules if they are passed and if you can't abide by them don't be a vendor on this site. Simple as that. I have been writing By-Laws and Procedures for almost 15 years and the little clarification I suggested was in both the vendor's and buyr's best interest's.

I also feel that there should be a link to the IFCC on the site somewhere as an ultimate end to disputes. I want to know that if I get ripped off by a fly by night vendor, and the mods try their best to resolve it but can't I can go to someone and they will solve the problem one way or another.

	Manhattan Reefs Manhattan Reefs, the best aquarium community on Planet Earth!

[Chiefmcfuz]

Thanks Dean and alrha for the help.

[Deanos]

SlamaJama: I understand your viewpoint, but remember, the Vendor Guidelines apply specifically to Vendors. I'm sure an addendum to the site rules can be added, addressing your concerns of a hobbiest selling in the FS/FT forum.

[SlamaJama]

Quote: Originally Posted by Deanos SlamaJama: I understand your viewpoint, but remember, the Vendor Guidelines apply specifically to Vendors. I'm sure an addendum to the site rules can be added, addressing your concerns of a hobbiest selling in the FS/FT forum.

i understand, but if some1 buys a banner to advertise goods/livestock on this site then wats the diff.......

if we all have to drive down an MR street @ 35 mph, then it should be for cars, buses, trucks, no matter if it was originally posted for trucks.

	Manhattan Reefs Manhattan Reefs, the best aquarium community on Planet Earth!

[House of Laughter]

I also applaud the efforts and agree it is the sponsors/vendors responsibility to educate, however, we take drivers education and we all speed on a regular basis, does that mean car dealers should stop selling cars to people that speed? I think not.

However, I refuse to sell anything to anyone whose tank can't support the animal's health and longevity. Those of you who have been to my place and made purchases, you know this. I just won't do it.

Making it a rule to vendors and sponsors is very difficult to police - however, I will never make a reasonable effort to discourage - I just won't sell it to you.

RONEN - saying vendors should operate ethically is NOT isolating vendors out, it is an educational responsibility for those ACTIVELY soliciting sales to educate their consumer. Sponsors are not actively selling they are advertisers and the user solicits sales from them and it is up to the consumer to be educated.

As for your Mod comment, I would tread lightly on your accusation of a mod making a recommendation verses saying what a user should consider - this approach will not get you any more sales and we have seen that approach doesn't work well in this tight knit community. I don't know 100% the thread you are talking about and next time you may want to lin k that in so it can be kept in context, however, my experience is that mods don't give absoluts, they give recommendations and access to information for users to make a decision by. Just my experience.

I like the rules, think they are well written and agree with them wholeheartedly - they are as fair as we can enforce and will be managable for all.

My .02

House

[scarf_ace1981]

i think the rules are fair and necessary.

[masterswimmer]

Admins, mods, obviously very carefully planned and well thought out.
Seems like an equitable arrangement for all.

Thanks for all the effort.
Russ

[ShaunW]

Quote: Originally Posted by Chiefmcfuz I think MR is holding it's vendors to a higher standard and it is that higher standard that makes MR the great community it is. To put some responsibility in the vendors hands is extremely admirable. If you want no responsibility open a Petco. Those are good rules if they are passed and if you can't abide by them don't be a vendor on this site. Simple as that. I have been writing By-Laws and Procedures for almost 15 years and the little clarification I suggested was in both the vendor's and buyr's best interest's.

Exactly!! It is the vendors choice to sell here, we are providing an advertising forum for them, making them adhere to the standards that we feel are fair is not too much to ask.

Quote: Originally Posted by Chiefmcfuz I also feel that there should be a link to the IFCC on the site somewhere as an ultimate end to disputes. I want to know that if I get ripped off by a fly by night vendor, and the mods try their best to resolve it but can't I can go to someone and they will solve the problem one way or another.

We cannot take responsibility for all actions by vendors. If a gripe occurs that affects all MR then we will get involved, however, the moderators of this site are not responsible for every problem (especially the small ones) that could happen.

	Manhattan Reefs Manhattan Reefs, the best aquarium community on Planet Earth!

[ShaunW]

Quote: Originally Posted by Chiefmcfuz Respect for our pets • You will not KNOWINGLY purchase or sell “difficult to keep” livestock to new hobbyists • You will not KNOWINGLY sell diseased, sick, dying, bleached or dyed livestock. • You will not KNOWINGLY sell livestock to a customer whose tank has not been properly cycled. I think the word knowingly needs to be added here as I have done above.

Seriously, this is common sense. Vendors should have reefkeeping experience. They should know that animals that they are selling. Selling corals/fish that are impossible to keep to reefkeepers is irresponsible and should not be done here. We ALL have to have some standards! We will also frown on individuals selling such things here also! So this doesn't just apply to vendors.