Im gonna start cycling the tank this weekend.Im gonna get a reactor.Should I run this after the cycle or during?Also when the takn is ready and has livestock do you run this all the time or just when you have a increase in phos then turn off when they drop is this the proper use of this reactor.Second question should I run a carbon reactor too,my sump has a chamber where you can put bags of chemipure is that enough. Tank size 40b.
Phos Reactor duirng or after cycle
- Thread starter SteveZ15
- Start date
- Location
- Brooklyn
Dont run anything during. Jackson's advise is wrong.
Why would you want to limit all the nutrients in the water when that is what is feeding the Bactria?
You fill the tank, dump in a large shrimp and thats it. No skimmer, no lights, no reactors.
Just a powerhead, and a heater. Then go grab a drink and wait 6 weeks.
Why would you want to limit all the nutrients in the water when that is what is feeding the Bactria?
You fill the tank, dump in a large shrimp and thats it. No skimmer, no lights, no reactors.
Just a powerhead, and a heater. Then go grab a drink and wait 6 weeks.
Matthew I can understand why you think my advice is wrong. It is a common misconception in the hobby. By limiting the amount of phosphate from dying organisms during a cycle you shorten the cycle and have better water quality when you're ready to stock. SKIM, GFO, and you DON'T have to introduce a shrimp to initiate the cycle if you are using live rock. You will not remove nitryfing bacteria to prevent a cycle from GFO and skimming.
If I am in fact wrong, why do I have a tank full of colorful acros at the one month point? A more traditional cycle method (as you describe) would barely leaved me cycled at this point. I'm not trying to argue, just telling you fact. I am not the only one who cycles a tank very fast using nutrient limiting methods .
- Location
- Brooklyn
Yes, if you use LR you dont need a shrimp. I didn't list out all combinations and possibilities 
I am basing my post on forum posts, and research. I would like to hear what others have to say on this.
I am basing my post on forum posts, and research. I would like to hear what others have to say on this.
Ok I just wanted to make sure the reactor wasnt going to be useless during the cycle.I was gonna get a lr or 2 to seed the tank,I want manado lr but im not sure if i should buy online or just get at lfs,because you cant pick the shapes you want online.This is my first reef so I dont know the equipment too good.I wanted to wait till there is a phos build up get the react going and test a few days later to see how much the phos goes down,I kinda wanted to get a grasp of how much this removes in a few days.Im pro not gonna add all the rock at once so I am assuming this will make the cycle extended,is that correct.I wanted to make sure I wasnt going to burn through the media for nothing because I used it during the cycle.Also the first time I use the reactor should I change the media sooner than usual because of the high nutrients caused by cycle?
IME it becomes exhusted quicker during the cycle because of the die off. After your cycle is complete I would change it again.
What I would do is .. no protein skimmer for 3 months. Blue lights on ,Start dosing .. No white lights , and I would add a phosban reactor ,
In My opinion why, Because your trying grow coralline as fast as possible, also crushed coralline will help seed and speed up the process but dosing/kalk/reactor is also need with your water changes.. and when you see quarter size coralline that tells me your alk and calcium levels are in range..
As far as cycling when your nitrate and ammonia levels are zero add some cheap fish and feed em and encourage them to poop. and then wait till you see quarter size coralline on your glass..
In My opinion why, Because your trying grow coralline as fast as possible, also crushed coralline will help seed and speed up the process but dosing/kalk/reactor is also need with your water changes.. and when you see quarter size coralline that tells me your alk and calcium levels are in range..
As far as cycling when your nitrate and ammonia levels are zero add some cheap fish and feed em and encourage them to poop. and then wait till you see quarter size coralline on your glass..
- Location
- Howell, NJ
As rich said someone who knows from experience unlike scars. Run your phosban u will do great.
I wouldn't add water from someone else's tank unless you know their system very well and their QT techniques. Also water from an established tank is basically useless, you would be better off with a handful of sand from an established tank. This is not needed or essential though. As for taking the water from someone else's tank you don't want to chance introducing a disease into your tank like ich or something else, maybe even flatworms. Unless you don't plan on doing a QT process. Also I run my skimmer during the cycle and I always have, it removes excess garbage from your tank. I have always used live rock though as well. I don't have gfo running currently but it will be running by the end of the week, it is only beneficial to the tank and will not help or hurt the cycle in anyway. It will however keep the phosphates down and any head start you can get on thanks a good one. I don't believe in the lights off method either, your tank needs light to grow beneficial algaes and with no light there is no growth. You don't need to run the, on a full day like you would once your tank is running after the cycle, but light is needed. I wouldn't dose during the cycle, you have no corals or anything else in the tank using anything, so why would you need to dose to replace something that never left?
- Location
- Howell, NJ
Good sound advice by someone who knows. Jaa great advicme mannnnn
The live rock is pro what i will do,I also have another question I plan on using the eco system mud in the fuge do i add that the day i add the salt water to the tank.I should have the light soon. I had fish before but not reef so I wasnt sure if anything was different in the cycle for reef because of the different componets used in the filtration.
- Location
- Greenpoint Brooklyn, NY
For simplicity's sake, this inaccurate and partially wrong graph i did by hand is visually what happens with bacteria and food/nutrients/whatever you wanna call it.
Bacteria grows, starves, creates food through dead bacteria (breakdown of organisms creating ammonia), bacteria bloom because of extra food (Ammonia -> No2 -> No3) then dies to starvation (no more ammonia to break down) and this all repeats until the bacteria to food ratio is established and then your tank is properly cycled.
Now, I just made this graph and explained a little about bacterial life cycles for fun. It really doesn't matter when you add Po4 into the equation.
As far as the relationship of Po4 to cycle specific bacteria during the cycle process, well there is none. On a normally cycled tank without a shrimp, Po4 isn't present until there is a breakdown of No2 to No3 and your tank starts to accumulate Po4 through the breakdown of No3 and waste in the tank. Even then in a basic tank cycle your not going to be noticing Po4 until you start feeding your tank with flake food known for adding Po4 into your tank. Or, directly leached from dead rock or other items which is the only place you would see Po4 in the tank come from during a cycle. I'm no biologist but im pretty sure bacteria are simple job specific organisms. They aren't like us that eat anything on our plate. Specific bacteria break down annonia to No2, and then another from No2 to No3.
IF Po4 was a direct food source for a beneficial bacteria that we want plenty of in our tank then we would be using that instead of GFO to remove it. Unfortunately Po4 is a delicacy of nuisance algae which like to quickly take over our tank if our Po4 isn't in check. Algae is also job/food specific which is why reducing your Po4 levels typically kills off things like hair algae. Actually, contained algae growth is also known for reducing Po4 in reef tanks as seen with cheato balls in your sump or other fast grow algae methods.
So, to sum it all up. You should use GFO/Po4 remover always including your cycle as there are other issues aside from the no3 breakdown that can introduce Po4 into your tank, things like uncured LR, older sand, improperly filtered water or leaching through other means. Po4 is and always will be a bad thing in a reef tank, you should focus on it even during your cycle. There are other things that can produce high levels during a tank cycle other than waste break down and cause you to have a higher than normal Po4 coming out of your cycle.
The only reason you would want Po4 in your system during a cycle is if you are prepping for a planted FW tank, or are setting up a marine algae tank or mangrove garden.
Bacteria grows, starves, creates food through dead bacteria (breakdown of organisms creating ammonia), bacteria bloom because of extra food (Ammonia -> No2 -> No3) then dies to starvation (no more ammonia to break down) and this all repeats until the bacteria to food ratio is established and then your tank is properly cycled.
Now, I just made this graph and explained a little about bacterial life cycles for fun. It really doesn't matter when you add Po4 into the equation.
As far as the relationship of Po4 to cycle specific bacteria during the cycle process, well there is none. On a normally cycled tank without a shrimp, Po4 isn't present until there is a breakdown of No2 to No3 and your tank starts to accumulate Po4 through the breakdown of No3 and waste in the tank. Even then in a basic tank cycle your not going to be noticing Po4 until you start feeding your tank with flake food known for adding Po4 into your tank. Or, directly leached from dead rock or other items which is the only place you would see Po4 in the tank come from during a cycle. I'm no biologist but im pretty sure bacteria are simple job specific organisms. They aren't like us that eat anything on our plate. Specific bacteria break down annonia to No2, and then another from No2 to No3.
IF Po4 was a direct food source for a beneficial bacteria that we want plenty of in our tank then we would be using that instead of GFO to remove it. Unfortunately Po4 is a delicacy of nuisance algae which like to quickly take over our tank if our Po4 isn't in check. Algae is also job/food specific which is why reducing your Po4 levels typically kills off things like hair algae. Actually, contained algae growth is also known for reducing Po4 in reef tanks as seen with cheato balls in your sump or other fast grow algae methods.
So, to sum it all up. You should use GFO/Po4 remover always including your cycle as there are other issues aside from the no3 breakdown that can introduce Po4 into your tank, things like uncured LR, older sand, improperly filtered water or leaching through other means. Po4 is and always will be a bad thing in a reef tank, you should focus on it even during your cycle. There are other things that can produce high levels during a tank cycle other than waste break down and cause you to have a higher than normal Po4 coming out of your cycle.
The only reason you would want Po4 in your system during a cycle is if you are prepping for a planted FW tank, or are setting up a marine algae tank or mangrove garden.
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of course you have something in your tank , Not corals but live rock, And your live rock will be the first to show signs of coralline. Will it hurt dosing nope..
I agree with Jaa 100%what he said accept for the dosing .. and the white lights no need to grow unwanted algae ( but it dont hurt ) ..Bacteria on a medium is what your trying to grow white lights have no effect on the growth of bacteria just saying...
Also if you have a DS i would 100% have a plenum with a maxi jet that will speed up the process 10 fold..
NEVER take water from anyone EVER.. Plus fresh mixed salt water is better, Your bacteria is adhered to the medium not your water , Fresh salt water mix is full of unspent trace elements and minerals. Why put water thats spent. Its a big misconception .
You won't grow enough coraline algae during a cycling period to the point you need to does. After the tank has cycled and you do a water change, then yes you could dose at that point, but that may not be needed either. Check your levels and decide if you need to dose. Or if you use a quality salt and keep up on you water changes, you won't need to dose. At least not this early in your tanks life. This also depends on how much coral is stocked in the tank and what types of corals.
also you do want to keep in mind that even with the introduction of coraline crushings... it does not mean that you will grow coraline in the tank. When the tank has matured properly and you have the proper water quality it will grow on its own.
So cycle the tank properly... if you are using dry rock... cook the rock prior to adding into the tank. This will limit any possibilities of leaching anything into the water.
Most importantly do not rush this hobby!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
So cycle the tank properly... if you are using dry rock... cook the rock prior to adding into the tank. This will limit any possibilities of leaching anything into the water.
Most importantly do not rush this hobby!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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