Lions Den FOWLR&DSB system advice

[Mouse]

Hello peeps,

I currently have a reef system and i beleve it to be fairly successfull IMO. But i still have this huge urge to keep lion fish. To satisfy this iv'e decided to start a FOWLR&DSB species tank for lions. Below are my thoughts for inhabitants.

2 Radiatas
3 Fuzzy Dwarfs
maybe some frog fish too???

What im wondering is how to keep the system clean, im thinking of a 5" DSB and some live rock. But i dont know how much to have to handle the filtration needs of the system, especially considering the inhabitants. Also another thing i have noticed about these fish is that when they dump it really is a hell of a load, my thoughts about this was to basically have the mother of all skimmers powered with some Ozone to keep the redox potential up. I was thinking about an algal refugeum but i feel this would be like going at something with a tinkers hammer when only a wrecking ball would do. Also what size aquarium would you recommend for these animals, im not shy on size so generous recomendations welcome, but i dont need to over kill as im planning on having a huge reef later on. Anyone out there have a lion fish species aquarium????

 

[FMarini]

Hi:
I set up my 180gal w/ lions in mind. Like yourself I wanted lots of lions, so i compromised. I have 7 species of lions, and a few fish that actually swim around.
If you email me off line I can give you details about my system. Its too much to write about it here.
AS far as the frogfish, these are a species tank only animal IMO, unless you get a small frogfish(which might be lionfish food) the frogfish will actually eat the lions..no poisonious spines don't stop them.

Last point, i do like radiatas as well, great fish, but in my experience they are the whimpiest of all lions and the most difficult to keep..maybe reconsider and try an P.antennata or P mombassae?

if you do email ask for my lionfish info sheet it has lots of lion husbandry tips and how-to ween all these fish onto dead prepared marine foods

frank
__________________
To see my 180 gal tank of lions:
http://www.marshreef.org/members/fmarini/index.htm

 

[FMarini]

Mouse:
Thanks for the email.I'll send you a response back
frank

 

[Mac1]

My sump is essentially a FOWLR tank, and houses a Blue spotted Toby. While not nearly as ferocious as a Lion may be, I manage to keep a few hermits (punishment for acts of violence in the reef), Astrea's, and Chiton's did remarkably well in there for a while for some reason as well. I have a DSB in there, loaded with Spaghetti worms, which do a good job of catching excess food and messy meals.

- Mac

 

[Anonymous]

Why are you under the impression that you can't keep a lionfish in a reef tank? Lions do great in reef tanks, you just can't keep smaller fish and crustaceans with them. Don't over feed them and disolved organics will not become a problem either.
I've kept lion fish for years, and I recommend at least a 135 gallon for the species you describe. Why not combine your plans for a large reef with your lion fish? There is absolutely no reason to why you can't do this.
Feel free to drop me a line...
[email protected]
Hasta
Jim

 

[FMarini]

JIm:
you bring up very valid points.
IMO most people want a few other fish in their tank, especially reef-related fish, very colorful swimmy fish, and having a lionfish in there negates this. People also like have moving inverts in their reef tanks, again having a lion in there prevents this from happening.

I see no problem w/ keeping lions in a reef, besides the obvious, and infact if you willing to have a few lionfish, then sure go start a moving invert less, small fishless reef.

Now the nutrient problem is something that has to be addressed. IMO this is where lions are not truely compatible. Lionfish live on meaty foods, and they like to eat, so your going to end up putting alot more waste/nutrients in this tank, and while DSBs usually can handle the organic load from a few big time waste makes. Having a school of lions might not give you satisfactory chemistries.

Again I'm all for having dwarf lions in these reeftank, sure you can't have movng inverts(except maybe hermit crabs), but at least you can keep other reef-type fish. W/ a med-bodied lion or large bodied your pushing your luck.
my opinion
frank

 

[Anonymous]

Tall bodied fish would work well too, like sailfin tangs, kole tangs, etc. A 180 gallon reef with a DSB could handle 2 or 3 lion fish without any problem, along with a few other fish.
You'll miss alot of the small fish and critters that are so enjoyable in a reef, but you'll get to keep other things that we otherwise couldn't think of keeping. I saw a beatuful stonefish the other day, he looked like he had patches of purpole coraline growing on him. I had to leave him be thoug because he would eat everything in my tank!
Jim

 

[Mouse]

Interesting responce guys, i would like to keep a Radiata and at 6" i dont think i would limit myself too much with the fish, but it would push me towards the Dwarf angels and tangs. Defenately a consideration. I guess if the water flow was good enough then even if it dumped directly onto a coral it should get lifted. The only small fish i would miss would be the fire fishes, and i think that the basslets etc may be out too. Im just worried that allthough the lion may be reef safe it would encourage other fish that weren't.

 

[FMarini]

Mouse:
You will be surprised and amazed on how big a lionfishes mouth will actually open, and how big a fish the lions wil attempt to eat (it doesn't matter if it actually eats it, becuz it will mane the fish in the process).

An adult radiata will be able to eat a small angel (like a flame angel), or a mid sized damsel, all the gobies, a long nosed hawk, so most of the neat reef-safe fish are out. The tangs are safe and the tall-bodied fish (as mentioned by Jim are also safe.

Think of it this way...almost all of the piscivores like snappers, scorpions, groupers, etc are reef-safe. They all have NO interest in corals, just swimming and walking things. So your interests will dictate what else is in the tank. For me if i were to have a reeftank and I had to have a lion in it. I would stick w/ a Fu or dwarf fuzzy, as this way i have my lion, and i can have all the other fish as well (no shrimps or crabs thou). Since your set on the Radiata no problem...just no small fish...pretty simple actually.
I think Jims assessement is right on a 4"DSB in a 180 should easily handle two or three lions. Just feed infrequently(3 times week), and keep an eye on your water quality.

Stonefish...also a great looking fish, but for me the distinction between poisonous (like a lionfish) and deadly (like a stone fish) is too extreme. I have been popped twice by a lionfish and it hurt like a mofo for a while. I wouldn't want to try out a stone fish, becuz you can't play dead for too long. Since they are so good at hiding in plain sight, i couldn't take the chance.
This week I have been tempted by a crocodile fish, a LFS has a 6" that looks so cool, this fish could already easily eat most of my tank occupants...buried up to its eyeballs in the sand. Too many great fish, not enuf fish tanks

frank