Am I A Reef Killer? Terrified of my tank!

[bc-matty]

Hey there guys! Here is yet another newbie question.

I am a little confused about what is going on in my tank, and I am in fear that I may turn out to be a Reef Killer! Oh God I hope not!

Once again here is the specs on my tank.
My tank is a 30g Oceanic tank. It is roughly 36 inches long, 12 inches wide, and 15 inches deep. Most people tell me that the average tank is 18 inches deep, and I thought hey 15 inches deep, all the better for as my lighting well have less space to travel, and I can build up my live rock higher. The tank is being filtred with a Fluval 304. The temp is 82 and that is without the heater on.

The tank has been up and running for nearly 2 weeks now. I have a sand bed, and it was just two days ago that I added my Cured Live Rock. Nothing else in the tank.

Here is my dilema... I mixed my salt like the pet shop told me, so that my salt levels were at 1.023. Two days later it was at 1.028. I almost fainted thinking what have I done wrong. There was very little water evaporation at least from what I could tell. Anyhow I removed some water and added fresh water. The level went down again. All has since been fine, actually my level was up at 1.025 which I heard was standard.

Anyhow I added the liverock on Friday. By Saturday my level went up again to 1.028. Not sure if the live rock had "salt on it from the dealers tank to lift up the levels or not. This morning a "voice" perhaps "God or Poseidon" told me to check my salt levels again.

I screamed in terror as my salt meter went all the way up past 1.030! and put any man on Viagra to shame! Sorry for the joke, but my meter was pointing straight up, and I felt like it was giving me the finger.

So I quicly removed some water, and added about 1 litre of fresh water. All is good again at 1.026. Not sure if I should take it down or not.

Okay so I need your help.. I don't want to be a Reef Killer.
I am confused about when to add fresh water and when to do a salt water change. I am used to having a fresh water tank, and it was just a matter of topping of the water, and doing monthly water changes.

Anyhow, how often should I add fresh water to my tank. every second day, weekly? daily? I am terrified that I will have high salt levels and the next time have corals and fish in the tank that well die. Also my water is evaporating, but not enough to drop below my water line. At the most I would say I teaspoon a day is lost.

I assume then that I must do a salt water change perhaps monthly.

Please help... I am so lost. Also I am adding two more larger pieces of live rock to my tank. Should I be ready for another spike in my salt levels.
Oh yeah.. if possible could you please tell me how much to add roughly of fresh water, and how much roughly to remove of salt water when doing the changes.
Thank you!
Matt
Oh one last thing.. does anyone out there add fresh water purchased at the Grocery store? I am think of using that kind of filtred water.. reverse osmosis? Is that good?

 

[esmithiii]

OK- here's the deal. First, your hydrometer may be giving you false readings. They are notoriously inaccurate. You should replace all evaporation with fresh water, daily if it is significant. Mark a line on the tank (or in the sump if you have one) and fill every day to keep the water level at the line.

Use the best water you can afford/get. I have used water from the grocery store before. It seems to work fine for me.

What kind of lighting do you have?


Ernie

 

[bc-matty]

Oh.. yeah.. I guess I forgot about my lighting. I have at the moment a regular canopy with one florescent bulb. The pet store was great in that they gave me a "marine glow" bulb which is suppose to be good for reef tanks. I will upgrade my lighting system in about a couple of months. I am waiting at least until the end of August. If my hydrometer is fooling me, what can I do to ensure I have the right salt levels?

 

[mooner]

<non-expert disclaimer here>

I'd take a sample to a reputable LFS and have it analized for SG and all other general specs and then, as esmithiii said, adjust to 1.023 - 1.025 (or whatever you have chosen as a target) if needed and mark the water level with some tape and just add fresh RO to keep it topped off. From the sounds of your lighting you shouldnt have to add a lot on a dialy basis. You can be sure that if you just keep adding RO top offs with NO SALT once you get it set your SG should stay steady. The salt can't be leaving your tank and there can't be any falling in (I assume).

From your description you have most likely not done any damage to the rock or your sand bed. I mean your meter was probably off and you didn't do anything crazy. Even if the readings you were getting were accurate (they almost couldn't have been) you are still ok. Natural reefs are often over the 1.030 you saw on your meter anyway.

I am sure you know already that your lighting is rather insufficent for most coral (there are some exceptions) but for the cycling process I don't think your lights are that crucial.

When you watch your cycle you may never see any notable ammonia or nitrates/trites with CLR. I never saw a thing with mine for 30 days and I still have not. I got mine from a good LFS and there was no secondary die-off in shipping as I brought it straight home and into the tank. This will vary and you may see some spikes in levels so just be patient and keep taking those readings. You should know if you are gonna see much ammonia after 14 days or so. I am convinced my cycle is pretty much over but I still have very little in my 44 gallon tank and 10 gallon sump (3 small fish and 3 small to medium coral). I am in a holding pattern too for another month.

Don't sweat it. You have done nothing bad that I can see. The fact that you are waiting until August shows you have the right frame of mind and are not in a big hurry to toss in critters into a young tank.

 

[esmithiii]

There are basically four options:

-Floating arm hydrometers (unreliable, but inexpensive)
-Floating hydrometers (more reliable, inexpensive but a pain to use: any current in the tank and they are useless)
-Salinity probes/monitors (about $100US, very accurate and precise but if they get wet they will be ruined as they are solid state. By far the most accurate and precise. You must replace the sensor regularly for about $20US. I used one of these for quite a while. They are the easiest to use by far.)
-Refractometer (also about $100US, much more accurate than hydrometers, but not quite as precise. This is what I use.

Here are some links:

Refractometer at Premium Aquatics
Salinity Monitor at Premium Aquatics

I hope this helps.

Ernie

 

[esmithiii]

At the very least have your LFS calibrate your hydrometer, and make sure that you are using it correctly (many times small bubbles stick to the arm and throw the reading off.

Ernie

 

[klingsa]

Yes, as Ernie said just now, make sure there aren't bubbles on the floating arm of the hydrometer. I usually put my finger over the top, and tap the whole thing lightly on a table. But look at both sides of the needle, and if there are still bubbles, stick something in there (toothpick, maybe? doesn't matter what) to get the bubbles off. It's a pain, but the thumping usually works for me.

One other thing I was thinking of is that specific gravity is dependant on temperature. Are you sure that your temp is at 82 all the time? Cause if it happened to be different that time you got 1.030, then that can explain it. You said the temp is 82 without the heater on? Does that mean you don't have it on, or that it just doesn't click on with the indicator light? Needless to say, turn it on so that the water temp doesn't fall at night with the lights are off. You probably know that, but no one mentioned the connection between temp and SG, so I thought I'd throw that out there.
(And if there's nothing to kill in there right now, DON'T WORRY! You'll learn all you need to know by the time you add something living.)

Sara

 

[bc-matty]

Ah.. much to think about, and a lot to learn.

I am wondering about a couple of things...
The next time that I do take my reading from my hydrometer I will perhaps shut off the filtre system. I do take water at the far end of the tank making sure that water is not flowing too much, but I will try with no water flow.

As for the bubbles, I am sure that there hasn't been any, but I will do the tap method to make sure there are none.

As for my heater.. being here in BC Canada, we usually have cool temps.. yeah it rains a lot. This summer however is a little warm for us. I have had the heater off completely, in fact it is not even plugged in. I tested it out for an hour to make sure it worked. I never really thought of my tank cooling off too much during the night.. duh. So I will keep my heater on.
The whole temp thing is controversial it seems. Books say around 80 -82. I am not sure if this is good, too high, or low.

What I have done so far since posting is gradually over half hour periods removed water from the tank and added fresh. I am at a reading of 1.023 again. I keep checking like I am obsessed.. actually I am! Oh the poor little critters on my live rock are missing. I hope they are okay. I had a tiny white brittle star fish waving at me from a rock the other night. Hopefully he and the others are okay, and like the night life, so I will see them again tonight.

I will keep the heater on.. to avoid temp drops and I will add a little fresh water daily.
Thanks guys.. I feel better, I love my tank.. and every time I pass it.. songs from the Little Mermaid fill my head... "Under the Sea" Heheheh

Oh as far as the lights... I am getting much better ones at the end of the summer.. when I am comfortable with my tank and feel confident in keeping corals.. of course I am told some well start to grow off my live rock.. at least the guy at the store was happy about the pieces he sold me.. like he was selling me his kids.

Even though I have cured rock with tons of coraline growth.. I am waiting till the end of August for anything big. I may add some hermit crabs next month... but my motto is "slow and steady wins the race" at least that is what I get from this site and you guys!
Thanks a million!
Matt

 

[mooner]

...but my motto is "slow and steady wins the race"
Thanks a million!
Matt

You're gonna be just fine! Great motto.

 

[saltnmyeye]

I have witnessed salt leaving the tank........Its not much but I sometimes have salt residue hanging outside my tank right between where the canopy sits on my tank. No significant change in S.G., other than what the evaporation does, but the salt is still outside the tank.........
Just my 2 cents.

 

[wasabi]

i dont know if anyone else agrees with this or not, but i litre of water is not going to affect the salinity very much. certainly not from 1.030 - 1.025. that is a pretty good determination that it was a false reading. you r going to have to add alot more fresh water than a litre to bring down your salinity that much. one thing i have found in most cases a plastic hydrometer reads a higher salinity usually by about 3/ 100ths.

 

[bc-matty]

You are definately right about the 1 litre of water removal not being enough to lower the salt levels. I had to remove much more than that to bring it down. I have since tested my levels twice again this evening and so far everything is fine. I wondered a little about the plastic versus glass hydrometers. Mine came with the purchase of my tank. The dealer told me that there wasn't a huge difference, now I am wondering.

Also I plugged my heater on and turned it to 76 degrees as that was the ideal temp level my book said. Somehow I am think I higher temp of 82 degrees should be okay for a lagoon type reef? I have to find out.. do you guys know?

Also happy to note that I found a bunch of little white bristle stars waving out of cracks in one of my live rocks. Seems the hitch hikers are doing okay.

Yeah!
"Life is better under the Water"

 

[klingsa]

Matt -

Does your heater have a regulator that clicks on when the water is cool and off when it's at the set temp? If not, I highly recommend using one of those. I've used the kind where the only control is a knob with a hot and a cool direction. That's just not enough control, IMO.

I really think your live rock critters will be fine. It's amazing how much they can live through. Think about their trip from the reef to your house. And most aren't shipped in water! That's crazy. But, the starfish you're talking about is most likely an Asterina. They are great at hiding, so I'm sure he's just cruising where you can't see him.

Yes, there are different opinions about the optimal temp for reefs. In nature, from what I've read, it's between 75 deg and 82 deg. One thing to watch out for when you add your better lights is the heat that they give off. Especially metal halides. You'll need a LOT of fans to cool the water. That increases evaporation, of course. There may be a time when your heater is hardly ever on. That's how it is for me, but it clicks on at night.

I just saw your new post, which wasn't there when I started this reply. I'm glad your critters are surviving! When you start getting algae blooms, you'll be a TRUE marine aquarist!! :lol: :lol:

Good luck!
Sara

 

[Enzo]

sometimes with the swinging arm hydrometers you have to season the needle with freshwater for 24hours. Just put freshwater in it for 24 hours and that may help. My swinging arm has never really given me any problems. Also check for microbubbles under the arm. Your best guess is to get a refractometer or a probe. It may be a bit expesive but it's worth it. You'll learn in this hobby that you can't cheap out on anything, or your tank is screwed. I learned that the hard way.