bubble tip anenomie emergency??

[kevineaton]

hi guys, hope all is well.

ok , our green bubble tip annenomie , which we got 4 days ago, has been fine up to now, he wandered for a few days but settled and hasnt moved for a couple of days now. this evening, all of a sudden, well, within half an hour, he has drooped. ill try and explain what i mean:

he was attached by foot to rocks about 4 inches off the bottom of the tank. his head was another 5 inches above that (by head, i mean the disk with all the tentacles), and seemed very happy, his disk about 8+ inches diameter. the clowns loved it.

now, his foot hasnt moved but his head is on the sand floor of the aquarium, and the head is closed up. the trunk is still pretty big, and there are some tentacles still waving at the edges of the closed up head. he is still moving occasionally, sort of pulsing like peristalsis (swallowing motion). the other tentcles that i can see seem much smaller than earlier.

i'll try and upload a photo.....see attachment. in this picture, he has moved his head sideways a bit, it was pointing straight down

so a few questions if you please:

1)is this normal behaviour or cause for concern?

2) if he is not well, what can i do about it?

3) at what point do i throw the towel in a get him out of the tank to save the rest of the fish?

thanks for your help!
cheers
kev


heres some detail about the tank:

have had our tank for about 3 months now.

it was a mature setup but when we bought it we had to move it.

everything survived the move - 3 chocolate clowns, 1 mandarin, 1 yellow tang, 1 humbug, 1 very large hermit crab (fist sized shell!), snails, rock.

we have about 45 kilos of live rock now. crushed coral base about 2 cm deep on average.

we have added 2 cleaner shrimp and a peppermint shrimp. both well, except the peppermint isnt controlling our apstasias as advertised! grrr....

tank is about 38" long x 17"wide x 19" high, about 140 litres

tank has bio ball filled trickle tower which leads to sump with bio balls, protein skimmer, mini-tricle tower with carbon chips, phosphate sponge, some other bags of stuff (that i have no idea what they are!), a couple of handfulls of calupera.

this then gets fed to a vecton 8 UV filter and then back to the tank.

tank readings today were:
ammonia <0.1
nitrite <0.1
nitrate 10 - 15
pH ~8.5
temp ~25

this is typical tank reading for last week.

 

[Anonymous]

OK, a number of possibilities here.

The first is that this is normal. Anemones are basically balls of water and periodically expell all the water and exchange it for a fresh supply. Leave it alone for a while and see whether within a day it's starting to look happier. If the foot is still attached, you may well be alright. If it's no longer holding on, and getting blown around, then you may need to start to worry.

Second is that it's not very happy with your nitrate level, which is very high for a reef tank. Your main problem is probably your trickle tower and wet/dry filtration which are handy for a fish only tank, but unnecessary for a tank with live rock and a potentially constant source of nitrates.

My guess is that the second will cause problems in the long term if it's not the problem now.

Before we can advise you on what to do next, you'll need to supply a bit more info.

What lights do you have? Normal fluorescents, power compacts, T5s or metal halides? How far from the bulbs is the anemone?

What model skimmer do you have? What size tank is it rated for?

Hope we can help,

Tom

 

[kevineaton]

ok, thanks for this. so, the answers are:

metal halide lights, sat about 7 inches above the water and a marine white T5 about 2 inches above the water.
its a berlin skimmer, rated for a much biger tank than mine, i dont know how much just at the mo, will post later.

anenome sits about 7 inches below the water level.

it looks a lot better today, its foot is still attached and its head has started to come up and open bit. the nemos are sitting in it at present!

btw, which part of my filtration is dry?

thanks again

 

[kevineaton]

hi....well, the anenomie has perked up again.

that was really scary last night! thanks for all the help.

is it going to do this often??!


just while we are here, im intersted in any sugestions you might have for the nitrate levels in the tank. a couple of weeks ago, the level was 25 - 50, and several months previous to that just after the tank move, it has been 100. i put some calupera in the sump and it is dropping , currently to its level of 10 - 15 now.

we have lots of live rock (45 - 50 kilos) and i thought that this was supposed to metabolise the nitrate , but maybe some of it died in the tank move?

any suggestions for the tank filtration / setup??

thanks again.

 

[Anonymous]

Well, if the levels are dropping in the way you describe, I'd advise you keep on doing what you're doing. Water changes will help as well.

I'd still advise you to get rid of the trickle tower/bioballs though. With your skimmer and live rock, you should have enough to keep the tank properly clean.

Good luck and ask more questions if you need to!

 

[kevineaton]

the bio balls will have a negative effect on the tank?

 

[ChrisRD]

One of the potential problems with using wet/dry filters in reef setups is that they are extremely efficient at converting nitrogenous wastes to nitrates and offer no denitrification (no anerobic areas to host denitrifying bacteria). This can end-up doing more harm then good in regards to water quality because it can result in a struggle to keep nitrate levels under control.

Live rock/sand offer a more complete means of biological filtration (ie. the denitrifying component) and skimmers physically remove dissolved organics from the water column before they break down, therefore those methods don't result in the excess nitrate issue.

 

[kevineaton]

ok....just so as i understand

the bio balls are metabolising lots of nitrogenous stuff, and kicking out lots of nitrates....so who gets rid of these? and where do they live?

can live rock not metabolise nitrates?

if i get rid of the bioballs...hmm, anyhting i should replace them with?

the main trickle tower (the one actually in the main tank) is full of them, if i get rid of them, the water falling in will make a lot of noise i suspect...the tank is next to our bed.....

 

[ChrisRD]

First let me say that the bioballs may not be the only issue in regards to a nitrate problem. Overstocking, overfeeding, lack of nutrient export (ex. a crappy skimmer), poor circulation (resulting in detritus build-up), use of mechanical filtration without very frequent cleanings, etc. can all contribute.

If you have a decent skimmer and it's working well that should be doing the bulk of the filtration work (ie. removing the majority of the wastes before bacterial filtration even comes into play).

The bacterial populations in and on the rock/sand will handle whatever is left. Live rock and sandbeds provide aerobic bacterial filtration much like the wet/dry, but they also have anerobic zones where the denitrifying bacteria live that consume the nitrates. Non-porous filtration media in a high flow area (ex. bioballs in a wet/dry) will not provide that environment - thus the last step (denitrification) is not provided.

Personally I wouldn't put anything where the bioballs are. If there's too much drop from the outlet to the water level in your sump, I'd extend the plumbing so it discharges just below the water line to eliminate the falling water issue.

Also, it's best to remove the bioballs gradually so bacterial populations have time to rebalance. Probably best to remove them over a couple of weeks just to be on the safe side.

HTH

 

[kevineaton]

wow! well, i learn something new everyday in this new hobby! thanks for your help guys.

i'll give it a try

cheers
kev