yet another T-5 question

[Elfili]

First of all, I'd just like to introduce myself. My name is Erick, and I'm rather new to the site. I've have a 20 gal nano that was a fish-only tank, hosting a lone percula, for over a year and a half. I've finally decided to take the plunge and take on the ever-so addicting hobby of corals. The current 20-nano now has a bunch of zoo's an palys that seem to be doing great.

To be honest, I'm more of a dart frog keeper and have over 20 or so tanks of poison dart frogs. Well, after much lurking and reading lots of posts, I've decided to chime in, as I've got more questions regarding the potential for an upgrade to a 72 gal. reef tank.

First of, I have a 6 bulb T-5 fixture, and was contemplating on upgrading the current 54w bulbs to the 80w bulbs by GE, Giesemann, and the like. Even after reading many threads (under searches for T-5, etc), I'm still a bit confused as it all seems like everyone has their own preferences, and results. My main question is, will it be a plug-in/out upgrade if I were to use the different bulbs? I've contemplated the idea of upgrading to an MH mixed set-up, but I've already got the fixture and would simply like to work with it. I'm planning of working with the basic LPS, but would like the flexibility of "maybe" adding some SPS in the future. If anyone is running a similar lighting set-up, perhaps they may be able to provide some insight. Looks like people have had different results with different bulb combinations, so a quick bulb line-up and livestock list would be wonderful. Once again, the tank is an AGA 72bowfront, reef-ready.

I apologize if this topic may have been beaten to death, so I'll understand if I get flamed.

Thanks in advance.

 

[masterswimmer]

Hey Erick, welcome to MR. Glad to see you extricate yourself from the shadows

I've been running T5's for almost four years now. With a quality fixture (ie: highly polished, individual, parabolic reflectors) you can keep any type of marine life under them.

The 54w bulbs you are currently using are 4' long. 80w bulbs are 5' long. So that would prove useless to you considering your 72g tank is 4' long.

Nice to see you doing some research BEFORE your purchases.

LMK if I can help you out in any way.

Russ

 

[Elfili]

Thanks Russ! That clarifies a lot.

I've ran across this, which is why it's sparked a bit of interest in higher wattage bulbs. How true to life are these projected figures:

http://www.drsfostersmith.com/Product/Prod_Display.cfm?pcatid=16768&N=2004+113907

It states 85w for a 48" bulb?

 

[Elfili]

Thanks Russ. That clears it up for the most part. However, I ran across some 48" bulbs at DrFosterSmith which claim to be 85watts. How true to life is that?

Thanks.

 

[ming]

The only way a 4 feet T5 bulb can be near 80W is by being overdriven by an IceCap ballast.

 

[NYreefNoob]

t5's

what i think you are reffering to doing is over driving the bulbs whic you would need to get another ballast like the ice cap 660. i myself have been using t5's for about 6 or 7 months on a mixed reef, sps and lps. ive gotten great growth and color. plus saved some money over mh { electric ect.} i currently run 3 tek t5 retro's 2 geis antic plus 2 geis 11k's and 2 10k's i like being able to have all the different lighting pars and color temps.

 

[fritz]

The thing with running bulbs on an icecap ballast is it pushes more wattage through them than the manufacturer intended. Icecap claims that it is done safely and without harming the bulb. I find this odd because their whole marketing strategy for MH bulbs is that their ballasts DO NOT push more wattage through the bulb than the manufacturer inteded, because doing so is bad!

The realty of pushing 80 or 85 watts through a 54watt bulb is that you run it WAY hotter and you also shift the color a bit. The biggest enemy of T5s is heat so running it hotter is not a good thing. On the crappier fixtures like Nova and Tech, there is no cooling so the bulbs get hot, change color and loose intensity. If you're able to blow air across the bulbs you'll see them brighten and revert to the correct color. There are many threads on RC that show the PAR drop considerably as T5s get hot, simply blowing air across them keeps the PAR high and extends the bulb life.

In short changing your ballast to an icecap and running 80watt bulbs will give you less usable light than your current setup has. I'm not a fan at all of overdriving bulbs. I have run them and I much prefer driving them at their intended wattage with a quality ballast, great reflector and active cooling for the bulbs.

If you're looking to get some really good bulbs to really get as much bang for your buck as you can I'd recommend the ATI bulbs. With a 6 bulb rig I'd do:
2 of these
https://diyreef.authsecure.com/shop...d=446&osCsid=585473a572a3727787a2ad0de9c3f711
2 of these
https://diyreef.authsecure.com/shop...d=449&osCsid=585473a572a3727787a2ad0de9c3f711
and 2 of these
https://diyreef.authsecure.com/shop...d=333&osCsid=585473a572a3727787a2ad0de9c3f711

That combination will give you the PAR of MH and a nice natural look. The PAR is so high in fact that you could use the GE bulbs only as a "noon" effect for a few hours a day. I'd stay away from Geisman bulbs, they aren't nearly as good as ATI for the money as their PAR is much lower. FWIW the ATI Aquablue special bulb is the exact same bulb that zeovit repackages and sells for $39. The aquablue special is the perfect bulb IMO as it has actinic peaks and peaks in what would be the 6,500 k range. It's a fantastic bulb with HUGE par.

Hope that helps.

Fred

 

[ming]

The heat issue is a very serious issue. I have two 120mm fans and a huge 20" fan also blowing my bulbs. It keeps the ambient temperature inside the canopy about 90F which supposedly is the ideal temp.

 

[Elfili]

Thanks all for the great info.
As far as running those three bulbs, (Fred) what would be a good on schedule? Also, keeping in mind that I only have a 3 and 3 configuration on the switches. It would almost make sense to join both the GE bulbs on the same switch, but which is the intermediary bulb?

Thanks again.

Thanks.

 

[fritz]

It really a matter of taste and also what works in your tank. What worked for the corals I kept + way I fed + way I skimmed etc may not work for the particular setup that you have. You may do things differently than I or keep different animals than I did. So the on/off schedule will be the result of trial and error and careful observation on your part. As to the colors, that's a matter of taste. I like a white-ish yellow look with a bit of blue. Some people like a really blue tank. It depends on what you like. If it were me I would do:
3 ATI Aquablue Special
2 ATI Aquablue
1 GE starcoat.

I'd play around with the bulb positioning till you get the look that you want. The problem with a 3x3 fixture is that you don't get any meaningful actinic usage. I like to use blue bulbs as my dawn and dusk bulbs but with three and three you can't do that. If you don't mind a blue look you could use:
3 ATI aquablue
2 ATI Aquablue Special
1 GE starcoat

and use the 3 aquablues as your dawn and dusk. Then just leave them on all day and add in the other three bulbs as your "main" lights. The 6 of them together will be blue but give your corals on overall good amount of light.

 

[fritz]

Of course if you're comfortable rewiring it you could do a 2x2x2 setup. The aquatinics fixture uses 2 ballasts but three switches and three power cords. That's a little more advanced than my electrical skills can even fathom but they pull it off.

 

[masterswimmer]

It really a matter of taste and also what works in your tank.

That just about sums it all up.

You will try one combination of bulbs and photoperiod. At the time of your first bulb change, you'll try something different. I've been running this T5 fixture for almost four years and can honestly say I've never repeated any bulb combination at change time.

My personal preference is the Giesemann D & D AquaBlue+. IMO that's a beautiful crisp white bulb. I like the UVL Actinic bulb for my sunrise/sunset period. I don't run any 6500K bulbs like the GE Starcoat at all. I don't like the yellow.

So there you have it. Various tastes, different preferences, both yielding successful results. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

Enjoy,
swimmer

 

[NYreefNoob]

t5's

i have 2 of the geis 6k's used for 2 days and took them off and got the geis 11k's i didnt like the yellowish look, question is do you want best growth or best color for your visual staring ?

 

[fritz]

T5s aren't like halides. T5s often have peaks that aren't necessarily obvious to your naked eye. For example the ATI aquablue special is an 11k bulb with almost the same par as the 6,500k GE starcoat. The ATI aquablue has just slightly less PAR than the 11k version and it is a 20k bulb!!!! You could never have par results like that in halides but many people's par meter tests have shown that higher k in T5s doesn't mean lower par.