Can ick last for months?

[reefer2011]

I'm so frustrated. Is it possilble to have ick last for months? I have a 46 bow reef tank. The fish include chromis, ocellaris clown, various gobies, firefish, and a cardinal as well as my inverts. Several months ago I had an outbreak of ick. The fish above seem to not be succeptible to it, but every time I try to add a new fish, it gets sick and dies. I'm talking at least 10 fish over the past 3 months that I have put in have all died. They are fine in the quarantine tank, but within 10 days of putting them in my reef, they croak. I have tried numerous natural remedies. I thought the latest one worked because my clown had it, but recovered with the latest treatment. I bought a dwarf angel and sure enough, it started showing signs of illness a few days ago, I woke up this morning, and it was dead. Any ideas on what's going on?

 

[qy7400]

Did you ever treat the display, ich will survive without the fish showing signs.

 

[rookie07]

Yes! You need to keep your tank fish free for over 6 weeks. If there are fish in the tank the ich will stay alive even if you do not see it on any fish.

 

[FlyTekk]

Whats the ich doing when we dont see it?

 

[KathyC]

Whats the ich doing when we dont see it?

Multiplying.

There are many stages to the life cycle of ich, but not all ich in a tank is at the same stage.

Read here on the life cycle of Ich:
http://atj.net.au/marineaquaria/marineich.html

You need to get all of your fish out of the tank and into QT and treated PROPERLY (so you are sure they no longer have it when you add them back!) - whether they look like they have ich or not (they do). You need to leave your display tank devoid of fish for ..in your case I would suggest 10 weeks.
Tough to do, but it is the only way to stop killing more fish

 

[Chris Jury]

Agreed: as long as there are hosts, ick will persist indefinitely. The white spots are a symptom of a severe infestation, (somewhat like chickenpox), but the lack of white spots doesn't mean there is no ick or that the fish are not infected. As above, the only way to be rid of it is to remove all fish from the tank for 6+ weeks (during which time the ick starves for lack of a host), treat those fish in another tank (hyposalinity is best) and then reintroduce them once the ick is definitely gone from the fish and the display--i.e., 6+ weeks. Alternatively, you can stop adding any new fish and hope for the best with the resident fish...

 

[reefer2011]

Agreed: as long as there are hosts, ick will persist indefinitely. The white spots are a symptom of a severe infestation, (somewhat like chickenpox), but the lack of white spots doesn't mean there is no ick or that the fish are not infected. As above, the only way to be rid of it is to remove all fish from the tank for 6+ weeks (during which time the ick starves for lack of a host), treat those fish in another tank (hyposalinity is best) and then reintroduce them once the ick is definitely gone from the fish and the display--i.e., 6+ weeks. Alternatively, you can stop adding any new fish and hope for the best with the resident fish...[/QUOTE

So if I remove the fish from display, the ich will just die off on its own? What salinity would you recommend for the quarantine? If I keep them in the quarantine tank at this salinity for six weeks my fish should then be okay to return to display?

 

[Imbarrie]

Are you sure there not something else at play that is weakening the new fish and making them susceptible to ich?

 

[ruha456]

Throwing this out there cause I heard it somewhere on this site. Is it true corals can carry Ich also???

 

[KathyC]

Throwing this out there cause I heard it somewhere on this site. Is it true corals can carry Ich also???

Yes, you can get Ich from a tank that is having an infestation.
When ich is in the tomont phase it has dropped from the fish to the sand bed where it is reproducing within cysts. Those cysts eventually break open and re-release the parasite back into your tank where it then looks for a host fish and the cycle starts all over again.

Those cysts can end up in corals in your tank..and be transferred to another tank. The coral is not hosting the Ich, it is simply the vehicle it gets moved on.

That is why we hear reefers say - but I haven't added any new fish, how can I have ich?! ...it could have entered their tank on a coral

So if I remove the fish from display, the ich will just die off on its own? What salinity would you recommend for the quarantine? If I keep them in the quarantine tank at this salinity for six weeks my fish should then be okay to return to display?

Yes. It is a parasite, it requires a host to feed off of, or it will die.
The link above has a tab in it titled 'Treatments', you will find full instructions in there on how to treat with either Hyposalinity or Copper. You need to do it properly, so I do suggest you read the entire treatment information which includes instructions on HOW to properly lower the salinity to the correct level.
If you cut corners or don't do it for a long enough period, the fish will still have Ich.
Do wait a minimum of 6 full weeks. By that time the Ick in your main display should be free of the parasite, as well as your fish in QT.

 

[ruha456]

I will be reading that article but if the Ich is apparent in a coral how do you rid it from the coral is there anything to do in that case???

 

[ruha456]

Sorry Reefer not trying to take over your post but figured we can all learn from this discussion.

 

[KathyC]

I will be reading that article but if the Ich is apparent in a coral how do you rid it from the coral is there anything to do in that case???

The downside is the Ich will not be 'apparent' in a coral. You really need to assume that all corals you add to your tank could potentially have Ich and QT them. Remember they need a fish host to survive.

When purchasing corals from another reefer, do ask if they have any pests in their tank (Ich is not the only problem you can transfer into your tank..there are AFWE, flatworms..etc) it is a good idea to see their DT to observe how their fish look..if they are all in a seperate tank..I'd pass on the coral.

 

[Paul B]

The fish above seem to not be succeptible to it, but every time I try to add a new fish, it gets sick and dies.

This happens frequently and it used to happen to me. You are correct that you have ich in your tank and it is not affecting your fish. They have become immune or undoubtably they also would be dead. But you said, they are living fine.
I believe many fish in many tanks have ich but it is not causing problems, I am certain it is in my tank but has not caused problems in many years. If I put in a new fish, it sometimes exhibits some spots, but they disappear.
I am going to say something here that everyone on here will jump on me for but it is what it is and I have been dealing with ich for over fifty years so I have a little experience with it.
"If" you want to try something before you remove all of your fish for 8 weeks (which would also probably work) try this.
Only try this if as you say your remaining fish don't show ich and you are sure your new fish are dying from ich and nothing else.
The next time you add a fish (make it a cheap fish) Quarantine it as you normally do then don't add it right into your tank but put it in a container used for livebearers or one of those hanging baskets so the fish can be easily removed, put this in your tank.
Put some rocks in there so the fish can hide. Feed this fish well with some live blackworms and maybe clams if you can get it.
If this fish gets ich in a few weeks like you say the new fish do, then remove it and treat it in copper. After two weeks put it back in the cage in your tank.
The idea is for the fish to build up an immunity from ich like the rest of your fish seem to have (and all of my fish have and many other fish in many tanks have)
We as humans get shots of various diseases to build up an immunity.
Most people will disagree with me on this but my tank has not had visable ich in about 30 years and some of the fish are 17 years old.
So if you want, just try this and I would be interested in the results.
Of course if all of your fish are dying of ich, that is another story and if your new fish are not dying from ich that is also a different story.
If your new fish are not breathing hard before they dye, they do not have ich. Spots are not the most reliable indicator as ich spots are very tiny and look more like dust.
OK have fun while I wait for everyone to yell at me.

 

[basiab]

Nice idea Paul. I will just add my own thought that when you have a tank that your fish are immune to ich then it is probably a weak strain. And your idea should work because you give the new fish a chance to get healthy by removing him and then give it another shot. I had a situation where my new fish, that was totaly healthy in someones tank, came down with ich and I dipped him in malachite green for a half hour and returned him and all went well.

 

[Paul B]

when you have a tank that your fish are immune to ich then it is probably a weak strain. And your idea should work because you give the new fish a chance to get healthy by removing him and then give it another shot.

Ok, then maybe in his tank, it is a weak strain being that his regular fish do not seem to get it, according to him. Maybe a weak strain is the key, if there is such a thing.
The same thing happens in my tank so maybe I also have a "weak" strain. Who knows?

 

[FlyTekk]

I too had ich once. Never killed a fish. But when it went away, It went away for good. Even after adding new fish i dont see spots. It was a bare bottom with ridiculous flow so maybe i was catching them in skimmer and 100 micron sock... maybe not.

Anywho my question is this. If its true fish build immunity, then if i have the same fish for about 6+weeks... and ich hasnt been able to host them because they are all immune.... doesnt that mean that i no longer have ich. DOnt they die after no host for 6+ weeks? Cause i havnt seen ich since i started the tank 2+ years ago.

In other words, leaving the tank fallow for 6 weeks (no fish) isnt the same as leaving the tank with an immune fish for 2 years? or 1 year? Or 6 weeks for that matter?

 

[Paul B]

No. Ane no one is sure if fish can even be immune, it is just a theory.
There is a reason why some tanks are not bothered by it and it "may" be immunity but it could be something else like for instance there is something in the tank that is surpressing it. We don't know.
But in either case, ich could live in your tank forever without you ever knowing it. As long as there are fish in there the ich is probably active and re producing, it has not gone. Of course there is that matter that we do not know why.
I do know that in my tank at least, I never see it unless something is very weakened from something else, like jumping out or being bullied, then I may see ich return, but only on that particular fish. And that is extreamly rare. I have only noticed it maybe 3 times in many years.
If we knew the reason for this, it would be a huge boon for the hobby.
Most people will tell you that if ich is in your tank, it will someday rise and attack your fish. I have not found that to be the case but it does happen in many tanks.
Again, no one knows why. All we have is theories.

 

[FlyTekk]

ONe thing i read said to be fact in the report said that ich can only multiply for said number of generations. I forget if they get very weakened after many generations or die off completely. But i think the number was 8-9 generations and they're screwed. Who knows if any of this is fact.

 

[basiab]

Give me a break. How could there be ich around if they cant go more then 10, 20 or 100 generations.