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Anonymous

Guest
I have your standard hood for my 55. Two 24 inch regular ol' florescent tubes (20 watts, I think) Anyway, I want to build a small reef. Maybe 2 or three corals and have more fish. Do I really have to go out and buy a $500 lighting system? Can I get better bulbs?

***NOTE*** You all must be independently wealthy. I've had my tank running for 3 weeks and it's already slamming my wallet.
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Don't worry Matt, once you've got your tank all set up, the cost is really in the maintenance which isn't that much. It does hurt at the beginning though!
smile.gif


No, you don't have to buy a $500 lighting system, well, that is, if you only want to keep low-light corals. Incidiently, if you are fine with things like polyps and mushrooms as corals, the lighting that you have right now will suffice. However, if you want other things such as LPS, SPS, and clams, you will need much stronger lighting, and it will probably run you around $300 at least if you don't want to DIY.

HTH,


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E >< () !) !_! S
 
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Anonymous

Guest
Would replacing the bulbs with full spectrum help? I don't want to kill anything if I can (financially) avoid it????
 
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Anonymous

Guest
Matty2000

Not independently wealthy, just possessed.

You would be amazed at the number of reefers that max their charge cards, etc. to fund their reefs. I know of some who have even done second mortgages.

On the subject of lights, do it yourself is the best way to come up with lighting fixtures that don’t break the bank.

Some more info on what type of corals, etc that you are trying to keep will help the people on this list determine what kin of lighting would be “adequate” for you.

Regards,

Scott
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
I'd like to have a couple LPS and SPS, maybe a mushroom or two.

Where's can I find info on DIY hood/lighting system?

Will changing the bulbs to full or something else help, at least for now?

Thanks for you help!
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Nope, that won't help for LPS and SPS. If you want to keep SPS, then you are going to have to get or make a very good lighting set up probably with MH. Still plan on spending at least $200-300 for DIY.

Oh yeah, I've noticed that you've been posting quite a bit on the board lately, and I just wanted to encourage you to go ***slow*** with setting up your tank. I know you are excited just as everyone else was (and still is) about setting up a tank. IMO, it's best to set up about a 1.5-2 year plan on setting up your tank and adding everything you want. I have had my 40 up and running for about 1.5 years and I am still not done with it. Going slow and learning as much as you can will help you to save tons of money and have a very happy, healthy tank. So, learn, learn, learn, and read, read, read all you can. Make sure you've covered all your options. Figure out what you really want, and then go for it ***slowly***.
smile.gif


Cheers,


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E >< () !) !_! S
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
A NOVEL BY BOMPH:


There is no way you can keep anything but soft corals with that little light. And 40w is pushing that..... Don't mean to be a bummer.
smile.gif


What I did when I first went from FO (salt) to reef was buy flourescent tubes ( the LFS said they would do fine ) .I have 240w via 6 48" tubes on my tank, 3 6500K and 3 Actinic. I have had them for a year as of the 18th ( My reef's "birthday" and the day my wallet died ) Not the bulbs, the hoods...... The bulbs need to go every 6 months max.... I have only soft corals and mushrooms and they have done fine. The 2 LPS I have ( Favities and Open Brain, have done OK for the 9 months I had them, but the Open Brain turned from flourescent green and deep black to green and red/brown. The Favities has not grown much.

BTW, don't bother wasting your money on NO flourescent hoods for the tank. Be patient, save your money until you can buy the good stuff, or don't buy at all. Take me for instance. My reef has been set up for almost a year now. It is a 120g with 6 NO tubes on it with a waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay underrated skimmer. ( Amiracle ). 150 lbs of Sand, 145lbs of LR. 5 corals. I was sold the most horribly inadequate equipment for my reef by the LFS. Then when I told them what I had ( lights, skimmer ), they told me I should upgrade it. So they got me.. Sell me the crap and then when I realize that it is exactly that, crap, tell me I need this Super Duper Model which is twice as much as what they sold me. In the past 5 days I have bought via mail order

1) 2x400w 6500K Iwasaki MH custom hood with 2 110w Actinics powered by a IceCap 430. $910
2) ReefDevil 3 w/ Rio 3100 pump $315
3) Sea Swirl $159
4) Overflow $70
5) Sump $25
6) Return Pump. $70

My god, I can't bear to add that up, you do it for me......

You will be addicted to your reef, don't doubt it. Your significant other will hate it, they will hate that every present you want for X-mas or b-day is for the tank. Your wallet is going to suffer.

You should get the basics:

Good lights: either 2 175w MH + 2 VHO Actinic, or 4 96w PC's or 4 VHOS. )

Good skimmer: FOr a 55, get a Red Sea Berlin or A Turboflotor.

Sufficient LR: 55-80lbs

Sufficient Sand: 100lbs


My reef has cost me almost 4000 now. There is no cheap way out of this hobby. If I hadn't gotten suckered into the cheap stuff I would've saved 700 bucks almost, which would've bouth that Ca Reactor and Ro unit which are the two remaining items on my list to get equipment wise. Then I can think about getting some more coral.....


I will probably cream my jeans and drop dead the instant Federal Express brings me my hood and skimmer and it will all be for naught...
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A

Anonymous

Guest
I would at least have a look at compact fluorescents before you buy more NO fluorescents, because I can almost guarantee you that you will eventually upgrade your lighting. I have spent about $3K on my 55 gal aquarium now, about $500 on stuff I eventually put in the garage. So plan a little, and save a lot... Compact fluorescent retrofits are a reasonable bargain, you can get 2 X 96 W compact fluorescents from www.hamiltontechnology.com for about $250. I would however recommend 4x55 W, as you will be able to have light accross the entire 48" of the tank rather than 36" . That should be enough to get you started, and you can always add more lighting later if you need it.

The rock is a big expense, but also offers some options for cost-savings. You can put in dry, fish-store bought rock as base rock and then build live rock on top of that and the bacteria will colonize it all, and later, coraline algae and other stuff. You can mix a bit of live sand with ordinary argantie sand and save some money too. Buy the best skimmer you can afford for the aquarium, don't scrimp on it. I have now bought three CPK backpack II skimmers ($129 wth free shipping from www.marinedepot.com ). You can probably do without additional filtration, but make sure you have A WHOLE LOT of water circulation (3 or 4 pumpheads that can move a sizeable amount of water).

The main expenses are lights, rock and skimmer, in that order probably (although the rock can be more expensive with air shipping etc).

I bought rock from www.tbsaltwater.com and am generally satisfied, however it is very dense and you need about 2lbs/gal, whereas if you buy some of the best Fiji rock, you can get away with as little as 1lb/gal, which would save you a lot of money in terms of rock and shipping.

Finally, the best way to save money is to spend about $100 on books NOW. May I recommend the following?

Tullock, Natural Reef Aquarium
Fenner, Conscientious Marine Aquariast

These are each about $35. The best price I have seen for these and the following is at www.marinedepot.com and you get free shipping for orders over $100

Delbeek and Sprung, The Reef Aquarium vols 1 and 2 (this is more advanced and specialized, has nothing about fish) $59/each at marine depot, $85 at Amazon.con + shipping

Wilkerson, Clownfish (if you are thinking of clownfish and/or anemones) This is a great fish book in general, too.

Good luck, and don't stop asking questions!

PS: $3K on my assistant professor's salary with a wife and two kids and a dog was a big chunk of cash that rationally I probably should have saved for lifetime season tickets to the monterey bay aquarium. This hobby is NOT cheap, be forwarned. Someone (Nathan?) had a how much did you spend thread posted a few months ago -- you should find it and read it.

[This message has been edited by flounder (edited 16 February 2000).]
 
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Anonymous

Guest
Thank you all for your input. It's reassuring to know there are many experienced people out there who take the time to share what they have learned.

Honestly, I am taking things slow. I post a lot because I know that there is a lot I don't know. I hope I'm not irratating...I just want to do things right.

Thanks again for your help. I'm going to need it!!!

One last thing...I probably won't be able to upgrade my lighting for several months. In the meantime, would the full spectrum bulbs help the cool stuff living in my tank?
 
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Anonymous

Guest
here's two ideas for your wallet. www.ahsupply.com and homedepot. you caan get GE daylight fluoresents 5k less than $10 each and the ballasts for about $12. run as many bulbs as you can fit on top of the tank. about 4 to 6. that will give you 160 to 240watts of light. the ballast run two bulbs each.
 
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Anonymous

Guest
Nope, Matt, you're definitely not irritating
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smile.gif
(Irritating is more like: Hey, I just bought this 2 ft. shark for my 40 gallon tank. How do I take care of it?
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)... we just want to make sure you know what you're getting into and to not make the mistakes that we made.

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E >< () !) !_! S
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Thanks again! So...will the full spectrum bulbs help at all? Sorry to ask, but I can't seem to figure out the answer...

confused.gif


Thanks.
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
THE NOVEL, CHAPTER 2

Full Spectrum might not be bad, but the problem is that you don't have enough of it.... Mybe you might get another light strip 2x40w, 48" and put Triton bulbs in it? They are a NO bulb that is more intense that normal NO lights. I used to use them when my tank was FO, and they are brighter than normal flourescents. I would say this would set ya back 100 bucks with the bulb, but it is a temporary solution to an expensive problem. Your new light setup alone could cost much more that your tank itself, mine costs as much as a whole 120gallon package deal with all the substrate, 2 SuperKing filters, heater, salt, thermometer, hydrometer, stand, glass top and 2 2x40w NO Strips with Tritons in them. I must be crazy to spend all this money on it, but in the end it's worth it. I come home after 11 hours of tracking some stupid bug in one of my programs and sit down in front of the reef and it's as if I never left home in the AM. It's theraputic value is worth it, and it keeps me from strangling someone.....

Like exodus said, go REAL slow.... Like him, I'm on the 1-2 year program, and I will not buy another animal until I have what I consider to be the perfect setup. My goal is lots of SPS and Clams, so I know that eventually i'm gonna need a Ca Reactor, so I will wait until I have the Ca Reactor ( In June) until I buy either. Getting the RO/DI in April. In the meantime, I now have sufficient light with my new hood to keep just about anything I want, so I can get some LPS for the time being. Galaxy, Caulestrea, Frogspawn. Once I found out that my lights were horribly inadequate, I didn't buy anything but softies. I'm glad the 2 LPS I have are still alive.

I've waited for almost a year to get this far, all my levels have been steady for 4 months now on a kalk drip and buffer supplement, with a little iodine and strontium in there. You have to experiment and test alot to determine the tanks need for these. I would get a stable,mature environment ready for the coral before buying them. Unfortunately, that means that you have a tank with nothing but sand rock, water and the little LR hitchhikers for half a year. No fish, they eat the little critters you want to proliferate to mature the ecosystem and strengthen the food web of the tank. Start out with some snails and hermit crabs.

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My wallet lies at the bottom of my reef. Along with my brain.
 
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Anonymous

Guest
If I were in your situation, I would probably go for one full spectrum and one actinic bulb. The actinic as you have probably seen on this board is mostly for color, but will provide some light to your corals. Also, I am not so sure that two full spectrum bulbs will be any greater than just one with an actinic since were only talking about 40 watts of light here.

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E >< () !) !_! S
 
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Anonymous

Guest
Matty,

Like all have said, your best bet is to buy the best lighting you can afford up front. If you're really intending on keeping SPS, NO just won't cut it. For a standard 55, 2 175w MH with 6500 or 10K bulbs & 2 NO or VHO actinics would be what I would choose.
HOWEVER...on a budget, if you're willing to forget the SPS & just go with soft & some of the lower light LPS, you can get away with NO. I had a 55 setup with 3 48" shoplight fixtures ($15? each) running 3 GE 6500K bulbs ($7 each from home depot) & 3 NO actinics ($25? each from LFS). Total of 240w of good spectrum lighting for around $150. With this you can keep softs, & hardy LPS (brains, Caulestrea, some Euphyllia sp, etc).
Just ma .02
smile.gif

RG
 
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Anonymous

Guest
Matty2000,

I think you could DIY two 175W halides for about $350-$400. Don't screw around with NO or even VHO because you'll just upgrade later--I guarantee it.

Do you own a skimmer? That'll set you back too. And pumps, livestock, an RO unit...

Buy the halides. You wont regret it! Just drop the cash and forget about it.
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Matty, another thing you may want to do is buy used equipment. You'll always find people that are getting out of sw or upgrading their setup that have good equipment at a reasonable price.
Like BOMPH - and probably a lot of others - I was sold a pile of crap by my lfs guy, 1 25w bulb lighting even though I told him I wanted a reef tank, a SeaClone skimmer... you get the picture. So slowly I'm getting the stuff I've learned (thru these discussion boards) that I need. I'm always checking the classifieds and ebay. Just this morning I saw both VHO and MH lighting for sale at ebay.
It may be a way of getting the setup you want for a bit less money.

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What we got here is a failure to communicate
-Cool Hand Luke-
 

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