Electricity: Watt vs Amp
- Thread starter alrha
- Start date
there are other things involved and its impossible to figure out but if you are running 110V then 110W = 1 AMP
120V then 120W = 1 AMP
12V then 12W = 1 AMP
Now liek i said there are too many other things involved to ba able to just tell like that. If you are really intereted in finding out what kind of Wattage and amperage your equipment is drawing go on ebay and do a search for watt meter. They have them for about 20-25 bucks
120V then 120W = 1 AMP
12V then 12W = 1 AMP
Now liek i said there are too many other things involved to ba able to just tell like that. If you are really intereted in finding out what kind of Wattage and amperage your equipment is drawing go on ebay and do a search for watt meter. They have them for about 20-25 bucks
this should help too, remember our tank equipment runs as a continuous load.
5.???15 amp circuits - A 15 amp, 120 volt circuit has 1,800 watts of power available for all the devices plugged into it (15 x 120 = 1,800).
6.???20 amp circuits - A 20 amp, 120 volt circuit has 2,400 watts of power available for all the devices plugged into it (20 x 120 = 2,400).
7.???What about the "80% Rule?" - It depends on how long the load will be connected. The NEC (the National Electric Code) has a requirement that branch circuits be loaded at no more than 80% of their overcurrent protection rating - fuse or breaker size. But that only applies to a continuous load, which is a load that will be connected for three hours or more at a time. So if you're wondering whether the circuit will handle your new computer, use the rule. For a hair dryer, ignore it.
8.???80% of a 15 amp circuit - is 12 amps, or 1,440 watts at 120 volts.
9.???80% of a 20 amp circuit - is 16 amps, or 1,920 watts at 120 volts.
5.???15 amp circuits - A 15 amp, 120 volt circuit has 1,800 watts of power available for all the devices plugged into it (15 x 120 = 1,800).
6.???20 amp circuits - A 20 amp, 120 volt circuit has 2,400 watts of power available for all the devices plugged into it (20 x 120 = 2,400).
7.???What about the "80% Rule?" - It depends on how long the load will be connected. The NEC (the National Electric Code) has a requirement that branch circuits be loaded at no more than 80% of their overcurrent protection rating - fuse or breaker size. But that only applies to a continuous load, which is a load that will be connected for three hours or more at a time. So if you're wondering whether the circuit will handle your new computer, use the rule. For a hair dryer, ignore it.
8.???80% of a 15 amp circuit - is 12 amps, or 1,440 watts at 120 volts.
9.???80% of a 20 amp circuit - is 16 amps, or 1,920 watts at 120 volts.
- Location
- Ossining, NY
Jhale,
That's good stuff - generally speaking I use the 10x rule.
Works for me, but if you're pushing the envelope, consider using the 80% rule or getting a dedicated line to run most of your tank. In the new fish room, I'll have a 20 amp and a 15 amp. The 20 amp will do most of the work for the 4 halides and pumps. The other will run the chiller and heater
Practice safe electrical!
House
That's good stuff - generally speaking I use the 10x rule.
Works for me, but if you're pushing the envelope, consider using the 80% rule or getting a dedicated line to run most of your tank. In the new fish room, I'll have a 20 amp and a 15 amp. The 20 amp will do most of the work for the 4 halides and pumps. The other will run the chiller and heater
Practice safe electrical!
House
I definately learned the hard way and burned out a socket when I upgraded to metal halides and my chiller went on. I added 2 20 amp circuit breakers to split everything up over 3 circuits. You dont even want to come close to the max because chillers are a motor and create a lot of "noise" on the lines and have been known to trip a circuit breaker that is near the max. This is why your refrigerator is usally on its on circuit.
yesterday i had two 20amp circuits installed just to run my tank. So i wanted to get an idea how many watts each could run so i split my equipment up accordingly. My Metal Halides alone are two fixtures at 720W each. So i guess those alone fill up one circuit (1440W good for 80% rule). Everything else will go on the other circuit (Pump -300W, Heater -300W, Fuge light -100W, fans/powerheads/misc/etc ~300W. Total ~1000W).
Thanks for all the info, it really is very helpful.
Thanks for all the info, it really is very helpful.
One more thing you should think about.
Depending on the type of ballast you are using, it will consume more amps\watts at start up. The coil and capacitor within the "tar" type ballast(heavy)needs to charge and heat up before the amp\watt consumption will come down to the normal operating amperage. You should not use the bulb wattage as the basis for your calculation, there are no 100% efficient ballast setups, the ballast will be room temperature if it is 100% efficient in turning the line voltage to a MH bulb voltage\freq.
The chiller compressor motor or any AC pump motors we use also use more amps during start up.
Buy a watts meter if you really want to know how many amp\watts your appliance is using.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=3240&item=5968472093&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW
[ April 14, 2005, 01:55 PM: Message edited by: cali_reef ]
Depending on the type of ballast you are using, it will consume more amps\watts at start up. The coil and capacitor within the "tar" type ballast(heavy)needs to charge and heat up before the amp\watt consumption will come down to the normal operating amperage. You should not use the bulb wattage as the basis for your calculation, there are no 100% efficient ballast setups, the ballast will be room temperature if it is 100% efficient in turning the line voltage to a MH bulb voltage\freq.
The chiller compressor motor or any AC pump motors we use also use more amps during start up.
Buy a watts meter if you really want to know how many amp\watts your appliance is using.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=3240&item=5968472093&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW
[ April 14, 2005, 01:55 PM: Message edited by: cali_reef ]
WOW, good info on this thread....I guess I'll be putting my halides on a seperate 15amp circuit.
I really like how all the info on this website is down to earth and easy to understand. If this was on RC you would have some crazy charts and electrical mumbo-jumbo that would be like reading a foreign language for me.
I really like how all the info on this website is down to earth and easy to understand. If this was on RC you would have some crazy charts and electrical mumbo-jumbo that would be like reading a foreign language for me.
good point. thats even better then (i read the wrong line).Originally posted by jhale:
Albert, you've got some room left on that 20 amp line, the 144ow is for a 15amp line
I'm curious what MH are 720 watts? are these some special lights?
The lights are the Aquaspace lights. Each fixture has two 250W DE and one 150W DE bulb (totals 650W but tag on power cord says 720W - i've also heard someone mention in a previous thread that DE bulbs use more watts than stated)
As far as higher start-up requirements for lights/chillers, as long as the main stuff are below the 80%, taking a little more juice at startup should be fine (based on what i read above).
Jackson, MR is really picking up with these high level discussions and it really is nice. like you said, the nice thing about it is that those of us that dont understand things can easily learn it (in english) in a friendly environment. we just have to make sure RC people dont find out about this forum.
why are some circuits 15A and some 20A? why not always use 20A circuits? do they cost more?
my box shows some circuits in my house and 20 and some at 15. the new ones for the tank i know are really 20 as the electrician just installed them specially to carry the heavy load of my tank. He also installed the outlets above the tank so that i dont have to worry about water driping onto the outlet or anything like that. I will then run a GFCI extension cord down to the cabinet and plug my stuff into there. At least now can rest knowing that i have two circuits dedicated to my tank that are new and capable of handling it.
[ April 14, 2005, 02:44 PM: Message edited by: alrha ]
You need a heavier gage wire for the 20Amp circuit, usually 12 gage instead of 14 gage used for 15 amp home circuit. The 12 gage wire cost slightly more but the labor to pull the heavier wire factors in more. Not many normal home circuit require the additional amperage, typically they are only used for dedicated air conditioner, central air handlers and electric hot water heaters.
The 20% rule is really for those brown out days, not as a pad or cushion in figuring out your actual requirement. Appliances will consume more amps if your line voltage is not the nominal it was rated at. Simpler explanation ? say you have a 60 watt incandescent light bulb and it is rated at 110V, it would use .545amps to light that bulb at 110V and .6amp at 100V, a 10% increase in amperage requirement. The circuit breakers are rated in amps, so you need to compensate the additional amperage draw by adding 20% margin or it will trip when the line voltage drops below nominal. As for chiller compressors, I know mine draws significantly more amps during startups, causing incandescent lights to dim slightly. I bet some people have notice their window air conditioners do the same when the AC kick on during those hot summer nights.
[ April 14, 2005, 03:09 PM: Message edited by: cali_reef ]
The 20% rule is really for those brown out days, not as a pad or cushion in figuring out your actual requirement. Appliances will consume more amps if your line voltage is not the nominal it was rated at. Simpler explanation ? say you have a 60 watt incandescent light bulb and it is rated at 110V, it would use .545amps to light that bulb at 110V and .6amp at 100V, a 10% increase in amperage requirement. The circuit breakers are rated in amps, so you need to compensate the additional amperage draw by adding 20% margin or it will trip when the line voltage drops below nominal. As for chiller compressors, I know mine draws significantly more amps during startups, causing incandescent lights to dim slightly. I bet some people have notice their window air conditioners do the same when the AC kick on during those hot summer nights.
[ April 14, 2005, 03:09 PM: Message edited by: cali_reef ]
now you are only talking about things on the same circuit lowering voltage? or even things from a different circuit? For ex, if my AC kicks in, would that lower the voltage (and raise amperage) on my tank as well? or would that only be affected when the chiller kicks in?
having two circuits, the lights turning on for ex should only raise the amps on its own circuit as opposed to raising both circuits, correct?
lastly, at what point would voltage decrease (raising amperage)?
having two circuits, the lights turning on for ex should only raise the amps on its own circuit as opposed to raising both circuits, correct?
lastly, at what point would voltage decrease (raising amperage)?
Okay, we may be getting a little too technical for Rich 
The brown out situation I mentioned is grid wide, like hot summer days where everyone is using the max potential of the power grid and the generator are operating at its peak. (Remember the black out you guys had recently?). Turning on a single appliance in a typical home should not cause a voltage drop in the entire home for more then a split second. However, this situation will cause other appliances that are more voltage sensitive to operate at higher amperage immediately, hence the 20% factor\protection. Incandescent light bulbs are not as voltage sensitive so they just dim a little, MH are somewhat sensitive so there is a capacitor in the ballast that will ?buffer? this lower line voltage and compensate by increasing the amperage intake. The incandescent dimming effect from the voltage drop will be most prevalent on lights in the same circuit, but the entire house may be affected if the wires going from the street into your house are operating at its limit.
As for when the incoming line voltage will drop lower than optimum is a hard one to estimate, the overhead power lines are typically 440 volts and is regulated or ?stepped? down to 110v at those big transformer you see every now and then(they are moving underground more and more). If everyone on your grid down stream from this transformer turns on their AC and MH at the same time, you will see a sub-grid brown out and the transformer should take a second to adjust it self back to the nominal voltage, provided the generator is running harder at the other end.
Some of this stuff is all learned in a class room a long time ago so I am not 100% sure if our current electrical supply grid system still operate the same.
The brown out situation I mentioned is grid wide, like hot summer days where everyone is using the max potential of the power grid and the generator are operating at its peak. (Remember the black out you guys had recently?). Turning on a single appliance in a typical home should not cause a voltage drop in the entire home for more then a split second. However, this situation will cause other appliances that are more voltage sensitive to operate at higher amperage immediately, hence the 20% factor\protection. Incandescent light bulbs are not as voltage sensitive so they just dim a little, MH are somewhat sensitive so there is a capacitor in the ballast that will ?buffer? this lower line voltage and compensate by increasing the amperage intake. The incandescent dimming effect from the voltage drop will be most prevalent on lights in the same circuit, but the entire house may be affected if the wires going from the street into your house are operating at its limit.
As for when the incoming line voltage will drop lower than optimum is a hard one to estimate, the overhead power lines are typically 440 volts and is regulated or ?stepped? down to 110v at those big transformer you see every now and then(they are moving underground more and more). If everyone on your grid down stream from this transformer turns on their AC and MH at the same time, you will see a sub-grid brown out and the transformer should take a second to adjust it self back to the nominal voltage, provided the generator is running harder at the other end.
Some of this stuff is all learned in a class room a long time ago so I am not 100% sure if our current electrical supply grid system still operate the same.
its so cool that you know all this stuff.
so it seems that my best bet would be to sneak into my neighbors' houses and install x-10 terminals on their ACs so that i can have my aquacontroller shut their ACs and turn on my devices in the event of a brown out.
so it seems that my best bet would be to sneak into my neighbors' houses and install x-10 terminals on their ACs so that i can have my aquacontroller shut their ACs and turn on my devices in the event of a brown out.
- Location
- Ossining, NY
Alrha,
This issue has to do with how much service you have coming to your house from the street - whenever a motor (and unit) like AC kicks on, it will alwasy draw from your house service and dim the lights for a fraction of a second. The larger the service you haev to your house, the less likely this will happen. if you have an older house (with 100amp servic) you may run a higher risk of this drop in lighting.
An additional answer to the question about why some 20 and why some 15's is noted in the above answer. 60 amps of service use at 15 amp lines gives you 4 circuits - at 20 amp lines, it only gives you 2.
Just a note
House
This issue has to do with how much service you have coming to your house from the street - whenever a motor (and unit) like AC kicks on, it will alwasy draw from your house service and dim the lights for a fraction of a second. The larger the service you haev to your house, the less likely this will happen. if you have an older house (with 100amp servic) you may run a higher risk of this drop in lighting.
An additional answer to the question about why some 20 and why some 15's is noted in the above answer. 60 amps of service use at 15 amp lines gives you 4 circuits - at 20 amp lines, it only gives you 2.
Just a note
House
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