MH is still the real king of lights IMO

[Reefcowboy]

Im a T5 guy, and have kept corals successfuly in all different lighting options. Not here to bash on any type, and actualy just redeeming myself to the still best lighting out there, in my opinion: MH.

Hot, high electricity bill, big, bulky fixtures...still the colors corals turn when under it are SICKENING!

I believe my tank is stable and colors of my sps are excellent compared to what i see out there. My T5 fixture is a quality one, dialed in with the best bulbs and perfect coverage. I grabbed a few clonies of wild fire digitadas from a member here a few months ago and even though they grew and are now a nice bright red...arent nearly as nice as the mixed red/ neon green they once were..this guy told me his tank is sort of a hospital tank, which he guaranteed any piece not doing well in other tanks would bounce back and color up quick in there. I gave him a frag of a green milli i have and now it is yelow with green tips..WTHell!

The previous owner had no blues, just plain MH and i see his tank and feel jealous of the true colors the corals have. Ill be moving in a year and am seriously thinking about switching to MH when i re set my tank in my new place. I would love to use a smaller, sleeker fixture even if it costs more...but the results i see in some MH tanks are worth all the money. Anyone here has converted to Mh and has seen great results to share?

 

[Jaftica]

i switched from, leds, to t5, now to mh, corals could not be happier, growth is awesome, and color is awesome, im using 2 250 wt radiums powered with m80 ballasts, electric is not really that much more, also i run the halides for 5 hours a day, with the t5 i ran them for 10 hours, 8hours all bulbs, and 2 hours just 2 bulbs, leds imo have no place in the hobby, for sps anyway.

 

[Reefcowboy]

i switched from, leds, to t5, now to mh, corals could not be happier, growth is awesome, and color is awesome, im using 2 250 wt radiums powered with m80 ballasts, electric is not really that much more, also i run the halides for 5 hours a day, with the t5 i ran them for 10 hours, 8hours all bulbs, and 2 hours just 2 bulbs, leds imo have no place in the hobby, for sps anyway.

Thank you for your input. Makes me happy this thread is going the right path. I figured would get hate from the ones that think im trying to bash on some systems, which is not my intent at all. Proof is i have a different one and gotta give it to the MH. Good thing is these days we have very nice blue led supplementation available, so we can also enjoy a nice "blues only" at times and get colors popping for different viewing.

I know this is an old topic, but what is in those systems that brings corals that "comfort"? Growth patterns are different, sps limbs seem to grow stronger...

Thing is i have a shallow 80 gal so i gotta do some reaearch on the Mh system, but yours seeem pretty nice

 

[Jaftica]

Lumenbrite reflectors are worth looking into, they would be perfect for your 80, and they can be mounted real high and give you awesome coverage, plus with being mounted high, heat isn't an issue, hth

 

[ecchybridLE]

Thank you for your input. Makes me happy this thread is going the right path. I figured would get hate from the ones that think im trying to bash on some systems, which is not my intent at all. Proof is i have a different one and gotta give it to the MH. Good thing is these days we have very nice blue led supplementation available, so we can also enjoy a nice "blues only" at times and get colors popping for different viewing.

I know this is an old topic, but what is in those systems that brings corals that "comfort"? Growth patterns are different, sps limbs seem to grow stronger...

Thing is i have a shallow 80 gal so i gotta do some reaearch on the Mh system, but yours seeem pretty nice

the comfort zone has not much to do with lighting, but flow and stable tank parameters. granted if you use low quality lighting weather it be halide,led,t5 that your growth patterns would be affected. i am a true halide guy , but i went led on my new tank and seriously impressed. the radion pro's work, and work well. getting true color from corals that came from 400 watt halide tanks. i focus more on tank parameters and scheduled husbandry to make my sps dominated systems flourish. i must say though that i had my thoughts of going back to halides, but i am going to give the led a real test. so far corals are growing really well and coloring up very well. only real complaint is that it is hard to get good photo's of the coral and i can more then deal with that.

 

[bhazard451]

i switched from, leds, to t5, now to mh, corals could not be happier, growth is awesome, and color is awesome, im using 2 250 wt radiums powered with m80 ballasts, electric is not really that much more, also i run the halides for 5 hours a day, with the t5 i ran them for 10 hours, 8hours all bulbs, and 2 hours just 2 bulbs, leds imo have no place in the hobby, for sps anyway.

My SPS growth and color in my LED only tank strongly disagrees with you. I do however believe that MH is king, but the heat, electricity, chiller or AC cost, non dimmable, no LED actinic blue only viewing unless supplemented setup is not preferable to me. I would rather have slightly less growth and all the advantages using LEDs instead. Electricity costs at my home are already $150 more than last year at this time, and this is WITH leds.

The problem with leds, are that no fixture on the market is truly correctly configured yet, but that will eventually change. It only took years before AI and Ecotech decided that Violets were vital (on the backs of DIY fixture users), so the market is very much learning how they should be used.

If cost is no object, I prefer MH/T5/LED combined. That is the ultimate lighting solution.

 

[Jaftica]

I don't use a chiller, the tank stays at 79-82 degrees depending on the ambient temp, just a cheap clip on fan is all I use, if you like LEDs stick with them, but I've never seen a full Sps tank have great coloration with them jmo, I do however use a blue acan led strip for actinic supplement.

 

[Moneymaks24]

Right there's no all SPS tank w all LEDs that looks good with great growth. Except every single tank in most LFS's or wholesalers all around the country and probably the world. There's nothing about t5 mh or any light for that matter that an led can't do. IMO

 

[bhazard451]

You haven't seen enough tanks yet then. This guy's tank is one of my favorites, using all chinese fixtures (Evergrow specifically)



Shot of mine (ignore the purple iphone tint). All colors are as they should be per coral. Blues are blue, greens are green, pinks are pink, etc.

 

[Jaftica]

You haven't seen enough tanks yet then. This guy's tank is one of my favorites, using all chinese fixtures (Evergrow specifically)



Shot of mine (ignore the purple iphone tint). All colors are as they should be per coral. Blues are blue, greens are green, pinks are pink, etc.

Glad your happy with your lights, your tank looks amazing

 

[Adamp_holydiver]

I agree mh Is the way to go IF you have the money and time to out in. Yes the color is great !!!
The bad evens out the good in my opinion and def keep a mix of t5 and mh and color do not need mh all the time

 

[bhazard451]

Glad your happy with your lights, your tank looks amazing

Thanks.

Would I say for anyone currently using MH/T5 to switch? Nope. Unless you specifically need to reduce costs from electricity or have heat problems, there is absolutely no reason to spend money on leds in that case. Starting a new tank would be the best way to go for them, and even then I wouldn't recommend spending a fortune on them. They'll be obsolete within 2 years max, and MH still gives better overall performance. Leds are getting close, but not quite 100% yet.

My fixture is highly custom. I've added leds like cyan and 430nm purple which no one even uses yet. I've had to experiment far too much to "get it right", and it can still use tweaking. They aren't plug and play like MH/T5.

 

[Waleedwale1]

I believe that LEDs have a lot of potential that has yet to be uncovered. One thing that I love about LEDs is the amount of customizations that can be done. Another advantage that LEDs have is that can be programmed. Each to their own I guess.

 

[strgazr27]

Right there's no all SPS tank w all LEDs that looks good with great growth. Except every single tank in most LFS's or wholesalers all around the country and probably the world. There's nothing about t5 mh or any light for that matter that an led can't do. IMO

Unsubstantiated, blanket statements such as the above are what causes threads like this to go straight to the toilet.

Every single tank in most LFS all around the country and the world probably? Do a lot of traveling I see. :scratchch

Talk to almost any LFS on the island and the number one reason they are running LED's will almost invariably be the savings on their electrical costs. Growth being a distant second.

So an LED can put out the same spectrum as a MH/T5 fixture can? Sorry, you're wrong. And the proof is more than easy to find. They are getting closer with each new design and fixture released but they are not in the same league.

Yes there are more than a few LED lit tanks with fantastic growth and impressive color. But if the owners are truthful almost every one of them will say they dose regularly to help with the color. And I'd be willing to be bet that more than a few who post images of their tanks have run the images through some form of software with levels, curves, color balancing and or a heavy dose of saturation increase involved. PS is notoriously a reefers best friend.

I have lit my tanks with T5, Radion Pro (Which lasted all of 1 week as the disco ball effect was enough to make 5/6 people who saw my tank comment about it being difficult to look at for extended periods of time and I could NOT find a color map or curve that gave the incredible look my MH/Actinic strip lighting does.

I run a 250W Ushio 20K and 2 12" LumenPro strips over a 60 Cube. The tank runs 81-83 during the summer months and 79-81 in the winter. I have never needed a chiller. The Lumenbrite reflector really helps with temps as it can easily be mounted 14-17" AWL and still provide rediculously high par numbers and even coverage.

I will continue to run MH until I see a fixture that can HONESTLY keep pace with MH in every aspect. Not simply impressive growth or electrical savings.

 

[strgazr27]

Glad your happy with your lights, your tank looks amazing

Thge upper picture is not his tank. And with what looks like 8 120W LED fixtures over it it's not exactly energy efficient compared to MH. That same tank could be lit with 3 400W MH in Lumenbrite reflectors and get the same coverage, same growth, better coverage and only 240W more electric use lol.

And its JMO but yes the colors are "there" they just have that typical "flat" look that LED's tend to produce.

 

[reefer4eva]

My whole reason from making the switch from MH/T5 to LED's wasn't too much about the electricity to run them but more for the temperature fluctuations that was causing my PH and other paremeters to fluctuate also.and I always ran a chiller

 

[strgazr27]

I agree mh Is the way to go IF you have the money and time to out in. Yes the color is great !!!
The bad evens out the good in my opinion and def keep a mix of t5 and mh and color do not need mh all the time

I picked up my Lumenbrite reflector and ballast for $100 in mint condition. The bulb was $70. It's 250 Watts. A radion Pro is $900. Do the math. It would take 3-4 years of running the MH before I reached the initial cost of the Radion. And in that time they will likely have released 2-3 new versions lol

 

[bhazard451]

So an LED can put out the same spectrum as a MH/T5 fixture can? Sorry, you're wrong. And the proof is more than easy to find. They are getting closer with each new design and fixture released but they are not in the same league.

Yes there are more than a few LED lit tanks with fantastic growth and impressive color. But if the owners are truthful almost every one of them will say they dose regularly to help with the color. And I'd be willing to be bet that more than a few who post images of their tanks have run the images through some form of software with levels, curves, color balancing and or a heavy dose of saturation increase involved. PS is notoriously a reefers best friend.

I have lit my tanks with T5, Radion Pro (Which lasted all of 1 week as the disco ball effect was enough to make 5/6 people who saw my tank comment about it being difficult to look at for extended periods of time and I could NOT find a color map or curve that gave the incredible look my MH/Actinic strip lighting does.

I run a 250W Ushio 20K and 2 12" LumenPro strips over a 60 Cube. The tank runs 81-83 during the summer months and 79-81 in the winter. I have never needed a chiller. The Lumenbrite reflector really helps with temps as it can easily be mounted 14-17" AWL and still provide rediculously high par numbers and even coverage.

I will continue to run MH until I see a fixture that can HONESTLY keep pace with MH in every aspect. Not simply impressive growth or electrical savings.

No, you're wrong. A LED fixture can absolutely be configured to measure almost exact to any MH spectrum you desire. To think light is not light because it doesn't come from a bulb and instead another source makes no sense. The problem is, very few fixtures, if any, choose to do that, and instead focus on certain peaks (which I do not like, and do not feel like it offers the best performance). The $900 Radion Pro is one of these lights that still don't properly mimic a MH spectrum.

What's wrong with dosing 2 part and mag or using a calcium reactor? Even with MH you should be doing this.

My shots are in their awful iphone point and shoot glory. They would look even better if I had a DSLR properly configured. LEDs are notoriously difficult to take pics of.

I also ran a Radion Pro over my tank in the beginning, shown below. Every reefer and non reefer preferred the look of the chinese custom side over the Radion. 2 of those fixtures cost me $750 total for my 125, meanwhile 3 Radions would have cost $2700, which is insane to look worse. The color is flat on the Radion side like you said, meanwhile it pops on the right. This isn't even the best led combo on the right, which has since been tweaked. The flat color is mostly due to the Cool Whites being used.





300w isn't too bad to manage. Your same setup across my tank in MH/T5 would reach close to 1000w. I currently stay under 300w total in lighting with leds.

I agree, MH is king, and leds are not worth the outrageous prices some companies are charging, but properly configured LEDs are not as far off as you think. To claim LEDs cannot produce the same light is incorrect however, and to say that pics are photoshopped on led tanks is just pouring gas on a fire.

 

[Jaftica]

What size tank is that ?

 

[strgazr27]

No, you're wrong. A LED fixture can absolutely be configured to measure almost exact to any MH spectrum you desire. To think light is not light because it doesn't come from a bulb and instead another source makes no sense. The problem is, very few fixtures, if any, choose to do that, and instead focus on certain peaks (which I do not like, and do not feel like it offers the best performance). The $900 Radion Pro is one of these lights that still don't properly mimic a MH spectrum.

What's wrong with dosing 2 part and mag or using a calcium reactor? Even with MH you should be doing this.

My shots are in their awful iphone point and shoot glory. They would look even better if I had a DSLR properly configured. LEDs are notoriously difficult to take pics of.

I also ran a Radion Pro over my tank in the beginning, shown below. Every reefer and non reefer preferred the look of the chinese custom side over the Radion. 2 of those fixtures cost me $750 total for my 125, meanwhile 3 Radions would have cost $2700, which is insane to look worse. The color is flat on the Radion side like you said, meanwhile it pops on the right. This isn't even the best led combo on the right, which has since been tweaked. The flat color is mostly due to the Cool Whites being used.





300w isn't too bad to manage. Your same setup across my tank in MH/T5 would reach close to 1000w. I currently stay under 300w total in lighting with leds.

I agree, MH is king, and leds are not worth the outrageous prices some companies are charging, but properly configured LEDs are not as far off as you think. To claim LEDs cannot produce the same light is incorrect however, and to say that pics are photoshopped on led tanks is just pouring gas on a fire.

Do you know why a picture taken under LED's looks different than that taken under a MH? Because the SPECTRUM is different. And ALMOST (As you yourself said above) is not the same. It's almost the same. The fact is there is not a fixture out right now that exactly replicates the tried, true and proven MH bulb. That was the point I was making.

As far as dosing I am not referring to the typical 2 part and mag or using a calcium reactor? Even with MH you should be doing this. Should be? I dose neither and yet MY SPS frags show fantastic color and healthy growth. I also havent done a WC in over 5 months but thats for another thread. I am talking amino acids, vitamins etc. Perhaps I could have been more specific.

All of the shots I am posting here were taken with an Iphone5 and than uploaded via TT. NO post processing involved. The difficulty involved in taking pictures under LED's is they rely so heavily on the Blue/Actinic part of the spectrum to make up for the lost color.

As far as your shots above I mean this with all due respect NONE of them look any good at all. Both lights have washed out almost all color except for the fish and even they lack punch. I would like to see the tank under the new "Tweaked" lights.

I fully agree with you about MH's finer points and pro's. As heat is not an issue w my setup I cannot agree with that fact but in general we seem to agree.

I just see you getting as worked up defending Chinese or "Custom" configured LED setups also...