Interesting and sad article
- Thread starter russianmd
- Start date
- Location
- Brooklyn, NY
It is worth noting that the situation in some parts of the world is much the same in regards to collection of marine ornamentals---a much smaller scale to be sure, but destructive and inexcusible none-the- less.
It is very sad indeed. This is a tricky one to stand in judgement of, aren't we a little guilty as well? I know some reefers purchase aquacultured corals, and tank raised fish. But there are few tank raised fish. And corals well I can't really speak on them since I don't really know much of what is available through the aquacultured coral market. I am probably going to get slammed all over the place with this post. But I just couldn't stay silent. Taking a really deep breath before I hit the "Post Quick Reply" button.:happysad:
- Location
- Ossining, NY
Awi,
Yes we are, BUT, knowing where people collect and how they collect and ONLY buying from those who manage those resources well is the "best" way we can control this. Meaning, only buy from suppliers who are net catching or free diving is best - the next best thing is advancing the captive bred range using advanced technology and science is another possible opportunity.
House
Yes we are, BUT, knowing where people collect and how they collect and ONLY buying from those who manage those resources well is the "best" way we can control this. Meaning, only buy from suppliers who are net catching or free diving is best - the next best thing is advancing the captive bred range using advanced technology and science is another possible opportunity.
House
- Location
- Brooklyn, NY
Awilda, that was my point. But we do need to be realistic and put it in the context of the far larger and more destructive, food fish industry. Still, complicity is complicity and we should not be in denial either. I agree with Jim too, but it is very difficult to distinguish these realities at the hobbyist or even wholesale level.
Kool, I'm not getting shot after all....
Prat, I was typing as you were posting.lol I didn't see you're post until I hit the submit button. I see that we both agree on the subject.
House, I know what you're saying. And I 100% agree with you,but how do we know for sure? We ask, and we're told what they know we want to hear.
"the next best thing is advancing the captive bred range using advanced technology and science is another possible opportunity." Wish we were there already.:frown:
I have narrowed my buying from you guys, if that helps...
Prat, I was typing as you were posting.lol I didn't see you're post until I hit the submit button. I see that we both agree on the subject.
House, I know what you're saying. And I 100% agree with you,but how do we know for sure? We ask, and we're told what they know we want to hear.
"the next best thing is advancing the captive bred range using advanced technology and science is another possible opportunity." Wish we were there already.:frown:
I have narrowed my buying from you guys, if that helps...
Drs. Foster and Smith have categories for tank-bred fish and acquacultured corals. The coral selection looks great (to somebody who is just about to get a tank) - the fish selection, not so much - but some staples I would want ARE there - e.g. clowns, gobies.
But all of these sentiments are exactly why I posted the link to the article - and there are resources to guide one to buy livestock from good dealers.
There used to be horror stories about wild discus populations being decimated in the Amazon - and the meager survival transport rates. But now, I am not sure why one would even buy wild discus when there are so many hybrids available that are captive-bred.
But all of these sentiments are exactly why I posted the link to the article - and there are resources to guide one to buy livestock from good dealers.
There used to be horror stories about wild discus populations being decimated in the Amazon - and the meager survival transport rates. But now, I am not sure why one would even buy wild discus when there are so many hybrids available that are captive-bred.
- Location
- Brooklyn, NY
Corals are far less of a problem as it is not common practice to use cyanide or dynamite to harvest them ( crowbars occasionally, which is not good), but fish collection practices have longer-term, farther reaching impacts on habitat that impact more than the target species.
You are right there is a small fraction of the desired fish species available as aquacultued, but there are locations ( Hawaii, Fiji, Tonga, the Solomons, Australia among others) that do practice more sustainable, harvesting methods and the two most notorious offenders ( the Philipines and Indonesia ) have areas that are "clean". The trouble is sorting this out as consumers which is not so easy AND both aqua-cultured and responsibly harvested animals tend to cost more... how many hobbyist look at price before all else?
These are complex issues that ultimately have to do with globalization, local and international politics and commerce, local issues of extreme poverty and corruption and environmental degredation from a host of sources etc.
Randy
You are right there is a small fraction of the desired fish species available as aquacultued, but there are locations ( Hawaii, Fiji, Tonga, the Solomons, Australia among others) that do practice more sustainable, harvesting methods and the two most notorious offenders ( the Philipines and Indonesia ) have areas that are "clean". The trouble is sorting this out as consumers which is not so easy AND both aqua-cultured and responsibly harvested animals tend to cost more... how many hobbyist look at price before all else?
These are complex issues that ultimately have to do with globalization, local and international politics and commerce, local issues of extreme poverty and corruption and environmental degredation from a host of sources etc.
Randy
Neat thread!
Then you have these rich people in these tropical paradises, building golf courses right beside the ocean/reefs...the pesticide and herbicide runoff in these high rainfal islands, DECIMATES coral populations...of course fish collection damages kill coral reefs as well....
Of course Al Gore says the reefs are dying from "Global Warming"...who knows....He promotes this is his new movie (Incovenient truth)....interesting movie, but someone needs to tell Al the elections over and he lost....LOL...LOL
Jerm
Then you have these rich people in these tropical paradises, building golf courses right beside the ocean/reefs...the pesticide and herbicide runoff in these high rainfal islands, DECIMATES coral populations...of course fish collection damages kill coral reefs as well....
Of course Al Gore says the reefs are dying from "Global Warming"...who knows....He promotes this is his new movie (Incovenient truth)....interesting movie, but someone needs to tell Al the elections over and he lost....LOL...LOL
Jerm
I have even been told by marine scientists that the rare sea turtles are having numerous birth defects lately..2 heads no flippers etc...and studies proved that ALL the "birth control medication" NEVER breaks down, and as said in Finding Nemo, all drains lead to the ocean...well thats somewhat true....Its said this man's birth control is wasting away our sea turtles and who knows what else..
Just an interesting figure to throw into this equasion..
Doc
Just an interesting figure to throw into this equasion..
Doc
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