Am I nuts?? I want to keep corals with non-reef safe fish (u
- Thread starter M.E.Milz
- Start date
- Location
- Virginia
I don't see a problem with what you're doing at all. I think that one coral that would be a nice addition is pulsing xenia. I housed some with a picasso and a large stars and stripes puffer without any problems before, and I had a friend who had a porcupine puffer in his tank.
For all the critics out there, how many times have you introduced a shrimp, a hermit crab or a centryopyge angel into your system? How many of you have had yellow tangs which can develop a taste for corals? Every single thing we add to our systems is a possible coral eater, with the exception of pure predators like lionfish. Even corals that we add are potential predators. Galaxea coral are definitely not what I would consider a community coral, nor are carpet anemones. Even soft corals can be potential tank killers in that some secrete toxins. How many of you have sea cucumbers or sea apples that could die and kill off your tank?
I think it's ludicrous to say that someone shouldn't do it since there's not a single person out there who hasn't put something in their tank, and probably that doesn't currently have something in their tank, that poses a threat by predation or by toxicity to the rest of their tank inhabitants. I, for example, have 2 yellow tangs, a coral beauty, a flame angel, and multiple hermit crabs in my tank, all of whom at anytime could decide that a coral is a tasty snack. I also have numerous soft corals, and who is to say that one of them won't release toxins into my system?
By the way, Mike, if you still have any frags that are for sale, I'd still like to purchase some from you. Also, if you want to try some xenia in your predator tank, let me know, it's everywhere!
For all the critics out there, how many times have you introduced a shrimp, a hermit crab or a centryopyge angel into your system? How many of you have had yellow tangs which can develop a taste for corals? Every single thing we add to our systems is a possible coral eater, with the exception of pure predators like lionfish. Even corals that we add are potential predators. Galaxea coral are definitely not what I would consider a community coral, nor are carpet anemones. Even soft corals can be potential tank killers in that some secrete toxins. How many of you have sea cucumbers or sea apples that could die and kill off your tank?
I think it's ludicrous to say that someone shouldn't do it since there's not a single person out there who hasn't put something in their tank, and probably that doesn't currently have something in their tank, that poses a threat by predation or by toxicity to the rest of their tank inhabitants. I, for example, have 2 yellow tangs, a coral beauty, a flame angel, and multiple hermit crabs in my tank, all of whom at anytime could decide that a coral is a tasty snack. I also have numerous soft corals, and who is to say that one of them won't release toxins into my system?
By the way, Mike, if you still have any frags that are for sale, I'd still like to purchase some from you. Also, if you want to try some xenia in your predator tank, let me know, it's everywhere!
A quick note, I am NOT posting the updates for the purpose of continuing the debate on whether what I am doing is appropriate or ethical, although anyone who wants to chime in is certainly free to do so. The reason I am posting the updates is so that everyone will have the benefit of what I am doing. As I said at the outset, I would keep people informed as to how well these corals do in this tank, good or bad. For example, if one of my triggers all of the sudden starts eating one of the leather corals, I will post it here.
Tanu, the butterfly in my reef tank is a Lemmon butterfly (sorry, I don't recall the scientific name). I think I added him last fall, and he has been doing great so far (and no problem with the corals).
Tanu, the butterfly in my reef tank is a Lemmon butterfly (sorry, I don't recall the scientific name). I think I added him last fall, and he has been doing great so far (and no problem with the corals).
March 1st update:
All four of the leather corals continue to thrive, although yesterday it looked like the fuscus trigger was nibbling on the toadstool. He looks fine today.
The yellow button polyps look great, and apprear to be spreading.
The few colonies of green star polyps that are still laying on the bottom of the tank (unattached) still have polyps that are opening up. This is pretty amazing since these colonies get tossed around regularly by the fuscus trigger. I am confident that star polyps would be fine in this tank if well anchored. I will be adding some live rock covered with star ployps in a month or so when I take down my reef tank.
I have not attempted to add any other corals since the last update, although I plan to add some more leather corals if I can locate some large enough. I will try to take some update photos next week to show how things look.
All four of the leather corals continue to thrive, although yesterday it looked like the fuscus trigger was nibbling on the toadstool. He looks fine today.
The yellow button polyps look great, and apprear to be spreading.
The few colonies of green star polyps that are still laying on the bottom of the tank (unattached) still have polyps that are opening up. This is pretty amazing since these colonies get tossed around regularly by the fuscus trigger. I am confident that star polyps would be fine in this tank if well anchored. I will be adding some live rock covered with star ployps in a month or so when I take down my reef tank.
I have not attempted to add any other corals since the last update, although I plan to add some more leather corals if I can locate some large enough. I will try to take some update photos next week to show how things look.
How about Anthelia? I have to scrub that stuff off with a toothbrush. Seems like the perfect coral: pretty, grows like a weed, easily grows back, etc...
Personally I am very interested in this sort of experiment. I honestly don't care about the occasional nibble on fast-growing corals. If they thrive (increase in size, spread, etc) it seems perfectly natural.
Personally I am very interested in this sort of experiment. I honestly don't care about the occasional nibble on fast-growing corals. If they thrive (increase in size, spread, etc) it seems perfectly natural.
<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by SPC:
IMO keeping a Trigger in a home fish tank is a long way from natural.[/QB]<hr></blockquote>
Can't the same be said for anything we are keeping in our tanks?
IMO keeping a Trigger in a home fish tank is a long way from natural.[/QB]<hr></blockquote>
Can't the same be said for anything we are keeping in our tanks?
I think this is a great experiment, especially the way it's being conducted, i.e. responsibly. No wild populations are being harmed, and presumably any coral that was being really chewed on, would be removed.
I'm very interested in setting up a tank very much like this, so hopefully more updates and a short list of what has worked will be posted.
I'm very interested in setting up a tank very much like this, so hopefully more updates and a short list of what has worked will be posted.
<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr> M.E. Milz, how is the tank doing now? Any updates?
Tanu
<hr></blockquote>
Yes, there are a few upadtes:
First, I have made some fish changes. I am getting ready to move and have decided to eliminate one of my FOWLR tanks, so I have been trying to move fish around between my other tanks and the tanks of a few friends. To this end, I removed a yellow tang and a soapfish (clown grouper) from the tank to make room for a purple tang, a picasso trigger, and a sailfin dottyback.
The 175g tank is now home to:
1) zebra moray (1.5 years)
2) dragon moray (1 year)
3) white mouth moray (6 months)
4) fuscus (bluelined) trigger (3 years)
5) niger trigger (10 months)
6) picasso trigger (4.5 years)
7) purple tang (3.5 years)
8) chevron tang (1 year)
9) dog faced puffer (10 months)
10) annularis angel (2.5 years)
11) sailfin dottyback (1.5 years)
12) eletric blue damsel (6 months)
I would characterize most of these fish as being medium in size (for example, the triggers are all in the 5"-6" range). I am, however, aware that I may run into problems as these fish continue to grow, although right now everybody appears to be happy and healthy. There is surprisingly little aggression between these fish, which I believe is because they are all of similar temperment. If problems develop (ie, stress/aggression problems), I will have to find homes for some of these fish. If so, then the tangs will be the first to go. In any event, I figure that I will eventually need a to get a larger tank as these fish continue to grow.
As for the corals, all of the leather corals (4 species) continue to do well. They are all expanded and growing, with no indication that they are being harmed.
The colony of yellow polyps are really starting to take off, and appear to be spreading.
I have also added another colony of green star polyps. This colony is well established on a piece of rock that came from another tank. So far (2 weeks), the fuscus trigger has not bothered it (like he did with the previous colonies). I am assuming that this is because either he cannot get to a lose edge of the colony, or becuase it is located in an upper corner of the tank where he doesn't exert as much territorial control over.
I have not attempted to add any other corals. But I plan to do so when I start taking my reef down for my move late next month.
If I get a chance, I will take some new photos this week and post them.
Mike
Tanu
<hr></blockquote>
Yes, there are a few upadtes:
First, I have made some fish changes. I am getting ready to move and have decided to eliminate one of my FOWLR tanks, so I have been trying to move fish around between my other tanks and the tanks of a few friends. To this end, I removed a yellow tang and a soapfish (clown grouper) from the tank to make room for a purple tang, a picasso trigger, and a sailfin dottyback.
The 175g tank is now home to:
1) zebra moray (1.5 years)
2) dragon moray (1 year)
3) white mouth moray (6 months)
4) fuscus (bluelined) trigger (3 years)
5) niger trigger (10 months)
6) picasso trigger (4.5 years)
7) purple tang (3.5 years)
8) chevron tang (1 year)
9) dog faced puffer (10 months)
10) annularis angel (2.5 years)
11) sailfin dottyback (1.5 years)
12) eletric blue damsel (6 months)
I would characterize most of these fish as being medium in size (for example, the triggers are all in the 5"-6" range). I am, however, aware that I may run into problems as these fish continue to grow, although right now everybody appears to be happy and healthy. There is surprisingly little aggression between these fish, which I believe is because they are all of similar temperment. If problems develop (ie, stress/aggression problems), I will have to find homes for some of these fish. If so, then the tangs will be the first to go. In any event, I figure that I will eventually need a to get a larger tank as these fish continue to grow.
As for the corals, all of the leather corals (4 species) continue to do well. They are all expanded and growing, with no indication that they are being harmed.
The colony of yellow polyps are really starting to take off, and appear to be spreading.
I have also added another colony of green star polyps. This colony is well established on a piece of rock that came from another tank. So far (2 weeks), the fuscus trigger has not bothered it (like he did with the previous colonies). I am assuming that this is because either he cannot get to a lose edge of the colony, or becuase it is located in an upper corner of the tank where he doesn't exert as much territorial control over.
I have not attempted to add any other corals. But I plan to do so when I start taking my reef down for my move late next month.
If I get a chance, I will take some new photos this week and post them.
Mike
The yellow button polyps and leather corals are all doing ok, although they don't look as healthy as they normally do. It may be the heat, or more likely, the fact that my calcium reactor is out of CO2 and I have not had an chance to re-fill it. I suspsect that my alkalinity has dropped since running out of CO2.
On the other hand, I have had a large growth of sawtooth calerpa take root.
I have not tried any other corals in this tank, particularly since my reef tank crashed during the move (but that is another story). Most of my efforst have been devoted to getting the new tank up and running.
On the other hand, I have had a large growth of sawtooth calerpa take root.
I have not tried any other corals in this tank, particularly since my reef tank crashed during the move (but that is another story). Most of my efforst have been devoted to getting the new tank up and running.
Carpentersreef":eowk9wiw said:Bummer....
Hope you didn't lose too much.
Mitch
I lost everything except for the critters in the rock and in the sandbed. Photos of my reef are still posted in the other album ("Mike's 200g Reef Tank") at the same website with the pic's of the trigger & eel tank that is the subject of this thread. Fortunately, I had just given a bunch of frags away 3 days before the crash, and the recepients have offered to help re-stock me once the new tank settles in.
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