so you are a reefer attorney eh!

[naesco]

We need your enlightened opinion.
Please see my post on page 5 of of the long thread on the dark side of reefkeeping.
Thanks eh

 

[hurrifan]

As a house keeping matter, and an effort to CMA, I must preface this post with the fact that I am NOT an attorney. I am in my final smester (15 days and counting) of law school and I will TRY to help in any way that I can. For what I know and have researched individual States may impose limitations and bans for particular species. I do not know about CA, but in FL for example they have devoted an entire section of the Florida Statute to Marine Life and its importation and harvest. Now, that being said, the majority of the regulation regarding the importation of marine life is done by the federal government. I have not located the specific Federal Statute addressing this, but when I do I will edit my post. For what it is worth, I plan on doing everything I can as a native Floridian, an avid diver and fisherman, AND an attorney to address many of the concerns raised in this forum. Again, I MUST STATE that I am not an attorney and this is not to be considered legal advice. I could lose my license before I even get. However, I am willing to help address any specific questions any of you all may have. Also, if there are any actual attorneys out there, please correct any mis-statements I may have made.


Florida's Marine Life Statute

[ November 07, 2001: Message edited by: Hurrifan ]</p>

 

[Anonymous]

I think a big problem that arises is due to the fact that most of the harvests are done overseas and not in U.S. jurisdiction. IN order to impose regulations on importation it would have to be federal in my opinion. I don't see how it could work any other way.

 

[hurrifan]

Rover, I would agree with you. However, as we all know there are numerous problems any time anything is Federalized. The imporation of everything is goverened by US Customs, and only a vary small portion of imports are even looked at. We have illegal snakes, birds and numerous other animals arrive everyday that sneak through legal channels.

 

[Anonymous]

I agree with you however, most people don't get corals and fish on the black market the way they do snakes and birds. In order for it to be feasible the importer would have to have the proper facilities like at a wholesaler. And there aren't too many wholesalers who want to be caught with any illegal animals. In a perfect worls the industry would police it self I just don't see it happening.

[ November 07, 2001: Message edited by: Rover ]</p>

 

[hurrifan]

Rover, the animals I am referring to are brought in illegally and get through customs, but are sold in local pet stores, out in the open,legally for the lack of a better word. There is NO enforcement at all. I am sure you have seen "banned" species at your LFS, I know I have. They are sold openly and with no fear of punishment. But, I understand your point and it well taken.

 

[davelin315]

I have not read the dark side post but I did look at your post itself and the answer to your question is yes, a state can impose a ban on anything it wants. It is called the home rule principle and its basic premise is that each state or body is sovereign. However, that does not mean that state legislation can be made willy nilly. There are certain criteria that need to be met (the law student above would be better at addressing this as it's been a long time since law school) in order for a statute to withstand judicial muster. Those depend on what the actual issue is and how it is framed. For instance, lawyers being the slimy bunch that they are, we could make a claim that a ban on a certain item is an unfair burden on a certain suspect group within the community and that the law as applied is unconstitutional due to its discriminatory practices. Basically, you are suggesting that a certain group has lost rights and privileges which are afforded to other groups. It's a big stretch of the imagination, but you get the idea of how the law works.

Bottom line is that most sovereign bodies can make up their own rules as they go along, and that's that. A good analogy would be a city like Chicago which imposes a handgun ban. If you bring a handgun into the city, even if it's not on your person and sits in a drawer unloaded in your house, you are subject to prosecution. The overall law in Illinois states that you are allowed to possess a firearm after you have obtained the proper license. This applies to the entire state of Illinois, however, Chicago contradicts this rule and does not allow the possession of firearms.

Extrapolating that logic to your case at hand, the United States as a whole can allow people to have reef tanks, and California could turn around and legislate against it, but that's they're perogative.

There is no real answer to your question (at least what I think your question was) without having a better grasp of California law. I only know Illinois law, and a ban here would work.

 

[Anonymous]

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote

Rover, the animals I am referring to are brought in illegally and get through customs, but are sold in local pet stores, out in the open,legally for the lack of a better word

Hmmm I 've never seen this. But then again Georgia has some of the strictest DNR regulations.

 

[Anonymous]

I've seen it, Glenn, more then I like. However, legislation against it is enforced. There have been two major convictions of coral smugglers under the Lacey Act in the past year and a half.

 

[hurrifan]

Legislation is enforced, but it is only a small drop in the bucket of what actually comes through the door, coral and animal. Problems with illegal animals is far more prevelant down here in South Florida b/c of the ultra close dealings with South America. It is a very unfortunate situation...

 

[Anonymous]

Legislation is enforced, but it is only a small drop in the bucket of what actually comes through the door, coral and animal.

Honestly, I'd describe the enforcement as developing teeth. The last coral smuggling conviction was against a group responsible for (if I remember correctly) the illegal importation of 250,000 tons of reef life over a five year span. Yearly, that sheer amount had to account for several percentage points of the total trade, legal and illegal, in the country.

As far as florida, I know of at least one large on-going investigation into a supplier there. I don't want to comment further then that, but just the fact that law enforcement is following through is heartening.