Mystery problem with tank

[Rscanmt]

Hello All,
I thought I might tap into the hundreds of years of experience on this list. I have a 55gal tank that is not doing so swell at the moment. The tank is about 8 months old with about a 3.5 inch DSB, about 30 or 40lbs of LR. I have 2 Parrot Wrasses (m and f) a blue Damsel, a Mandarin, a condylactis (sp?) anemone and some sort of flat anemone, a small colony of star pollyps, a small colony of zooanthids, and 2 gorgonians, and some snails and hermits. There are 2 aquaclear 802 powerheads and another smaller one for movement, a whisper hang on filter and a Prizm skimmer.
The problem is that I keep losing snails and most any crab or shrimp I put in there. They last for a while, but after a month or so just die. I had a green brittle star that did well for a month and all of the sudden lost all it's legs and died. I also has 2 emerald crabs and 2 sally lightfoot crabs that died as well (none of this happened quickly) I recently put MH lighting over the tank and now there in an "algae" problem. I say "algea" because I'm not really sure if it is algae. It's a light green haze that forms on the glass within an hour or so of cleaning it. I have tested the water and found nitrates, nitrites, phosphates so low that the test water didn't even turn a color. Ammonia is a bit high, but I know there are snails dead or dying in places I can't see them. pH is 8.3, specific gravity is 1.023, temp is 80. I also had the LFS test for copper and found none, iodine levels were undectectable (I have been supplementing that as well as calcium). In the last week I have done 2, 50% plus water changes with RO water, and next week have to move the tank out of the room and will do a nearly 100% water change again with RO.
I'm at a loss here. What am I missing? Why do snails and crabs/shrimp keep dying? I don't know what else to test for. Any Ideas? I do plan on adding a lot more LR in the future before any more livestock, but I don't want to put it in a poison tank.

Thanks in advance,
Randy

 

[imow]

Ammonia should be 0. Any trace would be toxic, especially to sensitive inverts.

Do water changes, get all params back in order, then give it another try with a few snails, making sure you spent several hours acclimating them.
By the way, how do you acclimate now???

 

[Rscanmt]

I guess I should clarify, I got about 20 or so snails when the tank was relatively new. They were acclimated by floating the bags and over about an hour or so adding small amounts of tank water to the bag water before putting them into the tank. I still have 10 or o snails in the tank. Some are doing well (eating algea off the glass and moving around a lot) but some are not. All of these snails have been in the tank from very early on.

 

[imow]

Are you actually seeing empty snail shells?? My snails spent days in the same spot on the glass sometimes. How do you know they are dying???
What Im thinking, is you are losing some snails to some predator, especially since it is over a period of time....Do you have any hermits???
I would still address the ammonia issue.
Did you see the emeralds and sallys' dead?? Or are they MIA??

 

[Rscanmt]

Yes, I have seen empty snail shells as well as hermits feeding upon them. The snails will sometimes sit in the same spot on the glass for days and they're not really hanging on with the whole foot, only part of it. As for the Sally's and emeralds, I have found one of each dead and one of each MIA. It looked like they died in the process of moulting, which is why I looked into the iodine and calcium problem. I am addressing the ammonia problem by doing another water change, and searching a little better for dead snails, etc.
BTW, thanks for your help/ideas imow!

 

[Anonymous]

I agree that it is probably some predator. Hermits are definately suspects. You should also look at night for a dark red bristle worm that lays mucus over the snail and the snail is unable to get air. After suffocating,the worm eats the snail(or some of it),leaving the rest for hermits and shrimps.

 

[John 3:16]

hey anemonebuff, i had a bristleworm( i think )do something like you described a couple of days ago to one of my snails. it seems like i have heard somewhere that snails might do better with a slightly higher salinity but i could be wrong. has anyone else heard this. my 2 cents

 

[Jawbone]

If your ammonia is under control ZERO I would get a new test kit or take water in and test for Nitrites wich is also lethal to shrimp and snail populous. and look for the elusive mantis

 

[Jawbone]

dumb question
is there any zeolite in your whisper filter cartridge

In either case remove the filter from the system you really dont need it unless you want the water flow the filter is pointless.

Thats why you spent all that money on that live rock and sand. Just run the skimmer and some other pump or pumps for water movement but get rid of the filter. Think about converting to a sump/refugium since your moving your tank anyway

[ February 18, 2002: Message edited by: Jawbone ]</p>

 

[jdeets]

Is your "parrot wrasse" a Gomphosus varius (aka green bird wrasse)? If so, then they're probably making making meals of your inverts. These guys reportedly will eat whatever they can fit in their mouths, including snails, crabs, shrimp, etc.

 

[jdeets]

http://www.wetwebmedia.com/gomphosusfaqs.htm

 

[reefmut]

snails are real sensitive to climate changes acclimation should be slower than an hour.... is there enough algae for them all to feed??

 

[Anonymous]

Do you have a link?

 

[Rscanmt]

Ok, sorry it's taken me so long to post back here, but I'll try and answer all the questions at once...
I had my water tested again yesterday and everything was great. All tested at or near zero. All the critters seem to be doing well once again. I do know now that there is iron in my water. How it got there, I'll never know but while using one of those magnetic glass cleaners, I noticed little chunks sticking to it after I cleaned the glass near the gravel. I'm going to be moving the tank next week for a day or two and when I do that, I'll be borrowing a huge magnet from the LFS to drag thru the sand bed and make sure there's nothing else there.
As for having enough algae to feed the snails, that definitely isn't a problem. Like I said in my first post, a aple green haze of algae forms on the glass within an hour or so of cleaning it. There is also a few spots of hair algae as well. I had some cyano in there but it has disappeared since the water changes. The Whisper filter on the back of the tank usually has nothing in it as a filter media. I use it from time to time for carbon or just mechanical filtration when I clean the tank, otherwise it's just for circulation. The "Parrot Wrasse" I have are a pinkish red in color. The male has horizontal fine stripes and a dorsal fin that reminds me of an African Cichlid, or a Ram. I'm trying to find a pic of one on the web so I know better what they are. It's sort of funny, I've always worried about the Mandarin the most as everyone says they're the hardest ones to keep alive, but the one I have (for about 3 months now) reminds me of one of those fan tailed, bug eyed goldfish. His belly is always so fat it's kind of funny to watch him try and fit into the crevaces he used to be able to get into.
Thanks again for y'all's help.

 

[Rscanmt]

Ahh, I just found what I believe to be the correct Wrasse. It looks most like a "Paracheilinus filamentosus", or a "Filamentous Wrasse". http://www.wetwebmedia.com/paracheilinus.htm

 

[Mouse]

That flat anemonie you mentioned in the begining. If it is a sand anemonie then that could have had your shrimps, also watch out for the Manderin with those arround.

[ February 20, 2002: Message edited by: Mouse ]</p>

 

[Ricpan]

You may have a PH problem with the brittle loosing its legs. What do you use for calcium/alk..