To skim or not to skim??

[Anonymous]

one of my tanks which i basically have been using to seed reef rock, has no skimmer on it. it did until i decided to pull it off and see the effects. it has been this way for a year come january.

the tank is very lightly stocked. a few star polyps and a clarkii with macro and some LR.

the amount of little pods is amazing. they cover the glass and are nearly microscopic. they weren't visible before the removal of the skimmer.

of course there is very little predation but i think this points to increased biodiversity to go without a skimmer.
i have never run a reef without one, so i am of little credibility in this discussion.

that said, i am out of here.

 

[SPC]

Posted by Skylsdale:

Basically, Eric sees the merits of both methods

-Agreed. My question however was related to whether he has published anything on this subject.

He hasn't just mentioned it from time to time, but actually practices it on a regular basis(pics can be seen on his website.)

-I am aware that his tank is skimerless and that he does practice this method. My point revolves around advocating this as a method for first timers, does he recommend that they start without a skimmer as you seem to have alluded to:

Wombat, to be honest, it is generally MUCH more difficult to wean a system off a skimmer than to add one later on.

He also articulated the emphasis on particulate matter that is important to coral feeding, where many particles take the place of plankton in our captive systems, and are still devoured by corals.

-There are different schools of thought on this. Many believe that one cannot even come close to what a reef provides in the way of food without polluting ones tank, thus the skimmer. There also is that fine line that must be walked in the import/export game.
Can an experienced reefer do this, of course. Will a newbe be able to, I don't think so.
There is also the herbivore issue. On a reef there is a predator for each living thing, in my tank there is not. I Have about 10 different forms of macro, plants, bryopsis and God only knows. I have one paticular bryopsis that I have yet to find a herbivore that will touch it. This stuff dosen't seem to require hardly any nutrients, grows into the rock, and would take over the tank if I didn't manualy remove it along with the pc of the rock it is growing in with pliers. Is there an animal that will eat this stuff, no doubt in my mind, but what it is I have no idea.
I also noticed that someone had asked Eric a few weeks back about what animals to use that would eat Y branch, he said he has never found one. He went on to say that he had a bad outbreak of this in the past (lasted a year maybe(?)) and had to manualy remove it and it was a real pain.

The tank I am currently setting up will be skimmerless and free of macro for nutrient uptake. It will rely on sponges, tunicates, bivalves, and various other filter feeders for the uptake of DOM. I will also carry out water changes to help provide in the export of some things from the water column, and an occasional harvest of sponges, etc. to export these elements that have been locked up in the organism's biomass.

-How many fish will you have in this tank? What kind of bioload?

Overall, I think too many of us try to recreate the "perfect" environment, and we try to prevent nature from taking its course in our tanks. One of the biggest things I have taken from what Eric has said is that our tanks engage in cycles and fluxes, just like the ocean. Rather than trying to "fix" these changes, we should sit back a little and see what happens--let the environment bend a little bit.[/b]

-I agree with the cycles and fluxes, but would strongly disagree that it is "just like the ocean".
Steve

 

[wombat1]

I'm planning on installing the Euroreef, but not turning it on initially unless needed. Thanks for everyone's opinions and great input.

 

[skylsdale]

My question however was related to whether he has published anything on this subject.

Nothing specific that I know of. He does touch on it a bit in Aquarium Corals(pg. 326). I really like his comments, "...and feel that the natural approaches some reef keepers are now trying are much more appropriate than much of the electronic wizardry that has traditionally fascinated so many marine aquarists. Perhpas the lesson is not to seek the ultimate technological fix, but rather to concentrate on what is most likely to keep corals of all types healthy and prospering--even if it means using tactics that are as simple and biologically fundamental as possible."

I have no idea what is opinion is on "newbies" starting out skimmerless, but I still stand behind my comment that it is easier to start a system without one rather than trying to take it off later on. If someone truly wants to run their system that way after asking questions and realizing things that need to be taken care of, then I fully encourage them to persue skimmerless reefkeeping--it's really not that difficult, and I'm blown away at the amount of myths and misinformation surrounding it(such as required lower stocking levels, etc.)

How many fish will you have in this tank? What kind of bioload?

Anywhere from 2-3 fish. The focus will be on a pair or trio of Fathead anthias, and probably a cleaner shrimp which many anthias appreciate. I think these levels are appropriate for a 20 gal tank(with an attached 20 gal refugium consisting of cryptic fauna.) But I will also be feeding the tank quite well, making sure the organisms throughout all get fed enough to grow as well.

I would also agree that our tanks are a far cry from the ocean. My point is that maybe we should loosen up a little bit and let things happen as they will in our systems.

 

[wombat1]

I'd suggest adding another cleaner shrimp. A pair will be much more active than a lone shrimp, and they will continuously brood and release larvae to feed your fish and corals. Mine just molted after releasing eggs, and a day later he/she's pregnant again. In another couple days the other one will be releasing his/her eggs. It's a great way to provide a regular, albeit small, dose of live plankton.

 

[skylsdale]

Thanks for the suggestion, Wombat. I was actually thinking of having a few peppermints in the refugium for the sole purpose of providing some extra food to the system via their spawnings, but the general consensus I got from people who kept them is that the spawnings weren't as frequent as I would like--and I think peppermints tend to munch on pods, which would defeat the purpose of my refugium. I may add another cleaner--we'll see how crowded the tank gets.