Any user input or comments on the Head Loss spreadsheet?

[npaden]

Just curious if any have downloaded it and tried to use it yet. I've found it to be a very user friendly and useful tool in designing various plumbing scenarios and in helping others with their plumbing issues.

Sometimes getting it set up and running the first time can be complicated because you have to install the solver add-in and everything but it is worth it IMO.

Any comments, complaints or suggestions?

Thanks, Nathan

 

[Modo]

I think it is one of the most helpful tools I've found yet. It was a breeze to setup. One request that may be implemented in the future, is to have a space for "T" fitting reductions. I know I'm trying to setup a new system and this would help tremendously!

One heck of a tool! Thanks for the time you guys put into it.

 

[liquid]

Heh, what's funny is that I've been using the spreadsheet for 2-3 weeks to help people out on the bulletin board after we got everything running properly. It is seriously nice to be able to just select your pump and input your plumbing design and have the resulting flow spit back at you in virtually no time flat. I think I gave more than one reefs.org member 8 different options on pumps that would fit his/her need in under 5 minutes.

I know the tee question is one option that we'd like to see in the spreadsheet but that's down the road a bit as there is a lot more math involved in it.

Shane

 

[sanjay]

Anyone using a Mac having trouble with the spreadsheet. ?

sanjay.

 

[AuroraDave]

Nice job. I thought it was easy to use and offered many configuration options

 

[kanapino]

Sanjay wrote:

Anyone using a Mac having trouble with the spreadsheet. ?

Yes, I'm having problems with it. But just with the Solver Button. It gets hung up in the script. I'm not sure exactly why: If it is the _Click that disturbs or something else? Because of the underline, I mean. Sometimes Mac is picky with things like that in scripts. But I am by no means a VBA pro.

If you figure it out before I do, please let me know.

Brian :?

 

[JerseyReef]

Nathan - I started playing with the spreadsheet and found that sometimes I can more flow (GPH) for a rated pump, even with nominal fittings and nominal pipe lengths. I sized up the fittings for a 1.5" rated pump to 2" and found that the flow was higher than the rating for the pump. I know that frictional losses have diminished returns after a certain point, but for a 1.5" pump, frictional losses should still be a point of concern at 2" at these velocities levels, not moot as the spreadsheet would suggest.

You can e-mail off line if you wish...

 

[npaden]

Jerseyreef,

I ran some numbers and you are correct. The spreadsheet doesn't seem to work properly on 2" pipe for some reason.

Here is a basic friction loss graph that may help: http://www.plumbingsupply.com/flowchart.html

Running the spreadsheet using zero feet of 1.5" pipe the sequence 6000 gives you 5,549 gph which is actually less than the performance curve shows. (It shows 6,000 gph at zero head). http://www.mdminc.com/Sequence_1000.htm

Running the spreadsheet at 20' of 2" pipe and 4 90 degree elbows gives me 5,458 gph at 5.3' of head.

If I back into it using the chart I get basically 5,100 gph at 11.3' of head.

That's not to far off (and that charts tend to err on the conservative side) but on flatter performance curves than the sequence 6000 might show more of a difference.

If you are flowing less than 3,000 gph through 2" pipe there really isn't much friction loss though. Running 3,000 gph of water through 20' of 2" pipe with 4 90 degree bends would only equal .77 feet of head pressure.

I'm not sure why the spreadsheet isn't working right, but I will try to check into it. I doublechecked it several times with 1.5" plumbing scenarios but it looks like there may be a bug in it on 2" scenarios.

Thanks for pointing that out!

Nathan

 

[JerseyReef]

Nathan - Thank for the quick reply. I finally had the chance to read your article last night and finally someone else who's been preaching frictional losses!!! It's the most overlooked item in setting up a plumbed system. I've always one sized up as a minimum, with two sizes up being preferred.

I wanted to use the spreadsheet to see where the "diminished returns" would be on the larger pumps and came across the 2" issue. I also found that sometimes the macro wouldn't update the gpm cell, however it would continue to update the velocity cell, albeit incorrectly. I would have to reset the form and start again.

Thanks for the link. I've used that page numerous times and find it very useful.

 

[npaden]

Mike,

Thanks for the compliments, Sanjay pretty much wrote the article and designed the spreadsheet, I just helped with the practical application stuff a little bit.

I just checked with Sanjay and looks like I was wrong. The chart that I provided is based on the Hazen-Williams formulas and they aren't very accurate for higher flow rates.

It looks like the spreadsheet is working right.

I also ran some test calculations with smaller pumps running through 2" pipe and they worked and didn't ever show more flow than the pump was rated for. The pump curves that are used aren't perfect (they only use 4 actual points on the graph and extrapolate from there) but they should get you pretty close.

If you have a specific calculation you are having problems with let us know and we will double check it for you.

Thanks, Nathan

 

[JohnL]

What's the URL to download the file?

 

[JerseyReef]

http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/ ... ipe-v1.xls