Unused food source

[Paul B]

Although there are many good types of food and some great types of food I would like to mention a food that I believe almost no one (except me :tired: ) uses to feed to saltwater fish. I am refering to live blackworms which are sold in just about every LFS (in NY anyway) but I find that they are rare in other states.
I know about the talk that freshwater foods should not be fed to saltwater fish and that is mostly true except for worms.
Fish will get into breeding condition in a couple of weeks by feeding live blackworms, how do I know? I have been feeding blackworms to fish to induce spawning and general good health for three decades. When I started in this hobby the only fish for sale were blue devils and a few other damsels. At the time I was also keeping fresh water and brackish fish so I always had blackworms. After just over a week of eating live blackworms, blue devils would start to spawn. I had one pair in particular that lived 7 years and spawned every few weeks by eating black worms almost exclusively. I also believe that they were responsible for my moorish Idol to reach almost five years old.
(he died in an accident) :tank: Blue devils, when sold are for the most part blue (duh) with clear tails. After feeding blackworms for a while some of the fish will also develop blue tails and these are the males. (personal experience) I don't know if they were born males or became males but since I have spawned many of them I know they are males. I do not keep blue devils any more but I never forgot what those worms did for the damsels.
I now keep mostly gobies (I get on a kich every now and then, now it's gobies) :biglaugh:
Anyway, just about all fish will eat worms and you can see very plainly how healthy fish will become with this food. Copperband butterflies in particular will really thrive with them and I would not keep a copperband without black worms.
The problem with most fresh foods like fish, squid, and scallops is that we are only feeding the muscle of these "meats" Most of the nutrition lies in the viscera or guts. In the sea, fish eat entire fish, not just the fillets. Almost all of the vitamin "A" resides in the liver of fish (Vitamin A in a shark makes up almost a quarter of it's weight in it's liver)
From my 40 years of diving I can tell you that most fish eat other fish, entire fish. Even tangs which are algae eaters pick up many baby fish in their quest for algae.
When we feed live worms we are feeding the entire worm, Worms are mostly protein and contain oil, not fat. Never having eating one myself (on purpose anyway :chef: ) I am not sure how much of what type of oil worms contain but I am fairly certain that they contain a good quantity of omega 3 oil.
I have been telling people for years that fish in breeding condition (which they seldom are in captivity) almost never contract disease. If you do any diving you can see the difference in wild fish as compared to captive fish.
Anyway, I will have to continue this later as to keeping, obtaining, and feeding worms.
I had some knee surgery a few hours ago and it's hadr to typw with my leg on the keyboard. :biglaugh:

 

[m'akoyPINOY]

thanks for the good info MR PAUL B.
good luck with the quick recovery

 

[DEEPWATER]

great info Paul ,thanks

would you think mandarin eat this as well ?

have a quickand painless recovery

Ronen

 

[scumonkey]

Good advice....I've been feeding black worms for over 30 years!
It's the one food most of my "hard to feed" fish go after first.
Do you rinse yours before feeding?
PS
get well soon!:smile:

 

[cb747]

Hey Paul i wish you a speedy recovery and if you need anything call

 

[Awibrandy]

Thank you for all the information. May you have a quick and painless recovery.:hug:

 

[Paul B]

OK so I am not the only one who feeds black worms :tired:
I do not rinse them because I keep them in clean water but I don't transfer the water from the worms to my tank. I pick them up with an old tweezer and put them in soem fresh water then I suck them up a few at a time with a baster looking thing and squirt them in front of the fish. Blackworms live about 20-30 seconds in saltwater so I doubt mandarins would eat many, if any of them.
There are three ways I know of how to keep them alive. One is to keep them between 40 and 50 degrees. That is difficult because refrigerators run at about 35 degrees. The second way is to keep them in a device specifically made for that purpose. It is a worm keeper that is available at a LFS. The worms are put onto a very fine mesh which is just touching the surface of fresh water in a container. I don't like those two methods because because the worms can't be fed and will gradually lose nutrition and shrink. I prefer to keep them in fresh water and feed them. This is a little tricky because worms eat a lot and put out a lot of waste. You need to grow bacteria on the sides of the container before you can successfully keep the worms for any length of time or the water will become very foul in a few hours. I have a plastic container about 8"X8". For a couple of weeks before I get the worms I "feed" the water with a cheap suspension food for corals or even Selcon. After a while the sides of the container will become slippery with a bacterial film. This bacteria does the same as live rock does and utilizes wastes of the worms. I add enough worms to cover about 1/4 of the bottom with airation the worms can be kept indefinately but they still must be fed with the coral food or just about anything, even flake food or pellets can be used. You can change the water but don't clean the sides. At first the water will foul every day or even twice a day, that is just a bacterial bloom which will subside soon.
Eventually the worms will keep the water sparkling clean. My culture has been going for years.
I also find that adding 2 drops of Metheline Blue to the worms helps to keep the water cleaner longer, it also tints the worms blue which is kind of wierd :biglaugh:
My knee surgery was not that bad and any day that I don't have to go to work is a good day
Have a great day.
Paul
http://www.aquariumfish.net/information/black_worms.htm

 

[Aqua Pro Builder]

OK so I am not the only one who feeds black worms :tired:
I do not rinse them because I keep them in clean water but I don't transfer the water from the worms to my tank. I pick them up with an old tweezer and put them in soem fresh water then I suck them up a few at a time with a baster looking thing and squirt them in front of the fish. Blackworms live about 20-30 seconds in saltwater so I doubt mandarins would eat many, if any of them.
There are three ways I know of how to keep them alive. One is to keep them between 40 and 50 degrees. That is difficult because refrigerators run at about 35 degrees. The second way is to keep them in a device specifically made for that purpose. It is a worm keeper that is available at a LFS. The worms are put onto a very fine mesh which is just touching the surface of fresh water in a container. I don't like those two methods because because the worms can't be fed and will gradually lose nutrition and shrink. I prefer to keep them in fresh water and feed them. This is a little tricky because worms eat a lot and put out a lot of waste. You need to grow bacteria on the sides of the container before you can successfully keep the worms for any length of time or the water will become very foul in a few hours. I have a plastic container about 8"X8". For a couple of weeks before I get the worms I "feed" the water with a cheap suspension food for corals or even Selcon. After a while the sides of the container will become slippery with a bacterial film. This bacteria does the same as live rock does and utilizes wastes of the worms. I add enough worms to cover about 1/4 of the bottom with airation the worms can be kept indefinately but they still must be fed with the coral food or just about anything, even flake food or pellets can be used. You can change the water but don't clean the sides. At first the water will foul every day or even twice a day, that is just a bacterial bloom which will subside soon.
Eventually the worms will keep the water sparkling clean. My culture has been going for years.
I also find that adding 2 drops of Metheline Blue to the worms helps to keep the water cleaner longer, it also tints the worms blue which is kind of wierd :biglaugh:
My knee surgery was not that bad and any day that I don't have to go to work is a good day
Have a great day.
Paul
http://www.aquariumfish.net/information/black_worms.htm

That's a very different way from the norm but that you can keep a single culture for years must be something right. I feed/grow black worms too. I guess many ppl who started FW first would feed worms to the SW too.

 

[Paul B]

Wingo, we here in NY are lucky because the worms are very common. I think they are the best single food there is for almost any fish. Of course I also feed other things.
Paul

 

[crox99]

thank you Paul for all the good info. Get well soon.:flower:

 

[scumonkey]

I have been spending many dead presidents for worms in small batches.....
I like the idea of of keeping a larger mass alive and well fed.
in your 8 x 8 container, how deep is the water, and what is it's source- RO/DI, Tap....?:scratch:

 

[prattreef]

I haven't used them for SW very much, but might just try them for a finicky fish I just received. I did use them extensively back in my cichlid days and remember a novel way to keep a larger batch clean and healthy for a decent period of time ( not breeding or feeding) was to put them in a fine mesh bag and suspend them in the tank of a toilet. After each flush they are cleansed and the temp is just about right too. This was of course before I was married

Randy

 

[JasonE]

I always knew you were classy, Randy.

I haven't used them for SW very much, but might just try them for a finicky fish I just received. I did use them extensively back in my cichlid days and remember a novel way to keep a larger batch clean and healthy for a decent period of time ( not breeding or feeding) was to put them in a fine mesh bag and suspend them in the tank of a toilet. After each flush they are cleansed and the temp is just about right too. This was of course before I was married

Randy

 

[scumonkey]

Brilliant idea!!!!!:lol_large

 

[Aqua Pro Builder]

I haven't used them for SW very much, but might just try them for a finicky fish I just received. I did use them extensively back in my cichlid days and remember a novel way to keep a larger batch clean and healthy for a decent period of time ( not breeding or feeding) was to put them in a fine mesh bag and suspend them in the tank of a toilet. After each flush they are cleansed and the temp is just about right too. This was of course before I was married

Randy

That's really some idea-both the temperature issue and removal of waste are done in the same place automatically and costing literally nothing.

So true I guess only singles can keep them like that.

 

[PalmTree]

Wow that is a good idea. How did you come up with that one? LOL

 

[Paul B]

Crox99, thanks. In a week I will try to go and do some collecting at the beach. With the bandage I can still get in the water up to my knee so it won't stop me from doing anything. The bandages come off in a couple of days and I will be as good as new. At least the worms are sold everywhere and I don't have to collect those :tongue1: .
I have a bunch of different types of gobies now and even though many of them are brown they do exhibit some nice color and better contrast between the brown hues by feeding worms. Many people I speak to don't know you could feed them to salt water fish, thats why I posted this thread.
Have a great day.
Paul

 

[Paul B]

Thats a great Idea about keeping them in a toilet tank, as long as the water isn't chlorinated. Of course my wife would have a heart attack if she saw them. She exercizes a lot and I just had knee surgery so I have to be careful where I keep worms.
Scumonkey the water is about 3" deep. If you keep them in a square container they will crawl up the corners about 2" out of the water so have a deep enough container or use a round one.
I don't know if I mentioned it but a drop of metheline blue in with the worms helps them live longer without fouling the water. No it won't hurt the fish I have been doing this forever and one fish lived for 18 years. It's tongue turned blue though :Yikes:

 

[DEEPWATER]

Now my bathroom is going to become a breeding ground for worms :lol2:

 

[Paul B]

Chris (CB747) I am going to pay the marina to put my outdrive on the boat. I won't be able to crawl under it this year, I have a hard enough time installing it with two good knees. I have a Volva Penta Dup Prop and the thing is about 200 lbs. If I get it done soon you can come out on a collecting or diving trip. I guess anyone else can come too. Everyone bring five gallons of gas, or Vodka which is cheaper. rangehat

I will get you all the hermit crabs, horseshoe crabs, snails, amphipods, worms and shrimp you can carry. :smokin:
Have a great day.
Paul