Can LR become dead rock? Recharge?

[Brandon1]

Very interesting discussion, it's crazy how you can have everything seemingly perfect and have symptoms of a huge problem. Thats what keeps us on our toes. Its like a doctor trying to diagnose a disease they haven't seen before... could be a number of things.

 

[Anonymous]

For a test I have left off my skimmer since Friday. I came home today (Sunday) and the Hair algae has grown where it was showing signs of leaving last week.

One of my biggest things here is to get the tank stabliized. I do not like using kalk, no matter what I use for a dripper it gets clogged in a day.

A reactor might do this but there has to be an easier way right now. B-Ionic didn't work in the past.
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g13 diesel strain

 

[Anonymous]

fwiw-

i've never ever seen anything to indicate that running a skimmer 24/7 will hurt any reeftank inhabitant in any way-through managing many tanks, and having sold countless skimmers over the yrs.

rather the converse is prob'ly far more likely

running the skimmer intermittently will cause a very large oscillation in the dissolved organics level in your tank, over VERY short periods of time, which can be just as stressful as swinging ph, alk, or any other environmental parameter

imo- you should choose whether to run it continually, or not at all

methinks that part of your issue, rob, is that you keep switching between methodologies waay to quickly, which doesn't allow any of them to work, or let you know if they are the applicable 'fix' to your problem

it sounds alot like your particular tank was stocked more quickly than it's capacity to replenish uptake of the major necessary elements like Ca/Mag, and that you didn't give enough time for your particular system to recover in its own time frame, once you corrected those levels

(no 2 tanks respond the same way, or in the same time frame, as any other)

hth

 

[Anonymous]

So you are saying that possibly adding frags of SPS used up all the Alk/CA/MAG?

If I stay with one thing, preferrably not Kalk due to the drippers constanly clogging and not a steady dosage. How long do I have to wait for something like B-ionic to show its working or not? I see have read a bunch of articles and seen new tanks setup relatively quickly that do not have these problems.

I am contiuing the water changes and I am not adding any livestock. I am also looking for a time frame for the tank to get corrected using what ever "Method" I end up with? If i am looking at a year, I will remove the corals and keep the MH off for a year since I am wasting electricity for no reason.
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Chevy Wiki

 

[Anonymous]

So you are saying that possibly adding frags of SPS used up all the Alk/CA/MAG?

if they used it up at a rate faster than you corrected, yes :wink:

If I stay with one thing, preferrably not Kalk due to the drippers constanly clogging and not a steady dosage. How long do I have to wait for something like B-ionic to show its working or not? I see have read a bunch of articles and seen new tanks setup relatively quickly that do not have these problems.

you're not waiting to see if b-ionic works or not....
you're waiting to see what happens once you keep the levels corrected properly w/b-ionic, or whatever you're using, for an extended period of time :wink:

I am contiuing the water changes and I am not adding any livestock. I am also looking for a time frame for the tank to get corrected using what ever "Method" I end up with? If i am looking at a year, I will remove the corals and keep the MH off for a year since I am wasting electricity for no reason.

it shouldn't take that long, but it will take awhile, imo (scale of months)

i'd keep running everything as you were, lights, skimming, etc.


watch for the reappearance of the corraline, and the other micro organisms hiding out in the rock (more are 'hibernating' than you may realize) :wink:

restock slowly-no more than 1 organism at a time, whether it be fish, or invertand wait 1 month between each addition, continually testing, and maintaining all of your parameters

patience, once again, will be key

one thing that many people seem to forget is that any change in status quo of any closed system involves 'micro swings' of various 'feedback loops', and these should always be allowed to 'settle down', before changing the status quo again

some tanks can take 20 frag additions at a time, some can barely react quickly and positively to one

when in doubt, always assume the worst, and play it the safest :wink:

 

[Anonymous]

thanks

In switching back to B-Ionic, Should I dose more than the recommended dosage? Wen I used it last time I added the recommended dosage every day for a month and it didn't budge the readings of CA/ALK. SHould I also contiue to dose Tech-M to raise the Mag levels?
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gremlin plant

 

[Unarce]

Good luck with that, Rob. I guessed that the skimmer might be the problem, but these guys know more about skimmers use than I do. It's been over 11 years since I've run one.

 

[Anonymous]

many people run skimmerless tanks w/no problems whatsoever

i'm trying to say either/or, not 1/2 and 1/2 :wink:

 

[Anonymous]

thanks

In switching back to B-Ionic, Should I dose more than the recommended dosage?

i called the guys at b-ionic waay back 'round '97-'98, and they specifically recommended to follow the instructions exactly-start w/their recommended dosage :wink:

Wen I used it last time I added the recommended dosage every day for a month and it didn't budge the readings of CA/ALK.

what kind of load did you have then, and were you also checking/keeping up the Mag levels? a low mag level may have increased the Ca uptake, and the alk uptake as well, leaving you with the false impression that nothing was being added by the b-ionic, when it fact, it was, but just gettin 'sucked up' too quick

SHould I also contiue to dose Tech-M to raise the Mag levels?
i'm not familiar w/that product- i used the esv brand mag, until i started using crystal sea salt, which tends to have much better levels of all 3 items-Ca, Mag, and alk.

i've tested mebbe 20 bags of the crystal at random, off the shelf, and got consistently good levels, using lamotte kits for measuring.

you just want to keep ALL the levels stable, and proper, as consistently as you can

which kit are you using for PO4?

p.s.-as long as your Mag level is around 1200-1400-you should be fine

i've also seen tanks w/slightly low levels,(of Ca, Mag, alk) using the b-ionic, do fantastically well

imo, slightly low, but proportionately correct levels are better than high levels that don't match each other :wink:

hth

 

[MLVA123]

Any cyano problems? I've read where outbreaks of bacteria or algaes can consume nutrients on which your corals depend. I would also extrapolate that to include the nitrifying bacteria on LR. If cyano or other stuff takes off, it could reduce populations of the "good" bacteria colonies and start a wicked chain reaction, resulting in tank crash. Just an idea; by no means a scientifically-based one.

 

[Anonymous]

thanks

In switching back to B-Ionic, Should I dose more than the recommended dosage? Wen I used it last time I added the recommended dosage every day for a month and it didn't budge the readings of CA/ALK. SHould I also contiue to dose Tech-M to raise the Mag levels?

i would continue water changes and additions of B-ionic.

i know when i was using a two part solution i needed to add it three times daily and it seemed to reach a point i couldn't keep up with demand.
i doubt you will efectively raise calcium with a two part solution.
water changes are the best solution, IMO. if not that i would use some turbo calcium and baking soda to get Ca/alk levels elevated.

 

[Anonymous]

thanks

In switching back to B-Ionic, Should I dose more than the recommended dosage? Wen I used it last time I added the recommended dosage every day for a month and it didn't budge the readings of CA/ALK. SHould I also contiue to dose Tech-M to raise the Mag levels?

i would continue water changes and additions of B-ionic.

i know when i was using a two part solution i needed to add it three times daily and it seemed to reach a point i couldn't keep up with demand.
i doubt you will efectively raise calcium with a two part solution.
water changes are the best solution, IMO. if not that i would use some turbo calcium and baking soda to get Ca/alk levels elevated.

you might want to try washing soda instead:

here's a good article on the subject:

http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/nov2002/chem.htm

for an extensive in depth look at most, if not all things pH/alk, go here:

http://advancedaquarist.com/index/ChemAqua.shtml

hth

 

[Anonymous]

you might want to try washing soda instead:

here's a good article on the subject:

http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/nov2002/chem.htm

for an extensive in depth look at most, if not all things pH/alk, go here:

http://advancedaquarist.com/index/ChemAqua.shtml

hth

because of his ph? or is there something else there i missed?

 

[Anonymous]

from what i understand, the use of either is determined by the present alk/pH situation. it seems to me that if your pH is high, and alk low, then baking soda(sodium bicarbonate) would be better, but if your alk is low, and the pH is high, then washing soda(sodium carbonate) would be better (look at the chart in the first article link)

generally speaking washing soda is a better long term buffer than baking soda, iirc

(i'm certainly no chemist, and my interpretation could be wrong)

one thing to remember, hower, is that not just sodium ions are important, which is why i personally feel that using b-ionic is a superior way to go, as you're less likely to upset the proportionate balance of all the other necessary ions, as well

just my non chemist $0.02

 

[Anonymous]

I use Salifert test kits.
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chocolate chunk plants

 

[shr00m]

i didnt think turnin the skimmer on and off was a good idea. just sounds outright nutty to me.

 

[cdrom1028]

Rob,
I tend to agree with PodMan. I run my skimmer 24/7 with no problems, I pull out about 1/4 gal of skim mate a week. the only time I turn it off is if company comes over or If I go out of town. I am targeting a Higher calcium level than what you listed (450 ppm) and my calcarious algae is growing on everything. I am in the process of building a CA reactor (http://www.melevsreef.com/dj88.html) to help automate this chore as well. I have my RO filter plummed to a float valve in my sump for topoff and I drip kalk w/ iodine. the magnesium I dose twice a week using the salifert liquid. I also use Marc Weiss coral-vital 10 Ml daily the big thing I had to learn was to take my time. Dose and wait 6-12 hours to test.

Good Luck!
8)

 

[Anonymous]

How hard would it be to get a reactor running on my tank?

It looks like a way to automate and maintain the ALK/CA levels.

Would going to a CA reactor now be a problem? Or a Kalk reactor? Or should I stay with the B-Ionic?
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[Fastmarc]

I still think that the fact that his calcium and alkalinity is out of balance (Alk 9 DKH & CA - 260) might be greatly contributing to his problem. I know this because I had a similar problem with my tank (and also a friends tank that I'm helping to sort out) and it was not until I read Randy's article and got it under control, that my tank started to improve.
http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/nov2002/chem.htm
Just something else to consider.

 

[Fastmarc]

.... also, ESV has a pretty neat dosing system for the Bi-Ionic if you are interested in checking it out.