Ick Ick

[JD'sReef]

So I have set my 46 up and everything was going real smooth. It has been running great for about a month with no problems. However, After a little bit, my mother decided to put a starfish from the LPS into my tank. Now everyone has ick and I am a bit nervious. I cought it pretty early and I am using rxp "Kent". I took out the starfish because he can't handle the dosing. (He causes the problem and then runs)
Anyhow, I was woundering if any of you have ever heard about increasing you water tempeture to speed up the cycle. I have read about it in fresh water, but not sure how much my mushrooms can can take.

Any Ideas, and how do I know if the star is ready to go back into my show tank?

Thanks All
J.

 

[Anonymous]

Hi JD,

First, I doubt that the starfish brought in the ich or even caused the outbreak. The cause was a fish that brought it in. Since you say your tank has not been up that long, it probably took this long for the ich to multiply.

Raising temperature is a double edged sword. On the good side, it speeds up the life cycle of the ich, which brings it through it's incubation phase faster, allowing you to kill it with medication in its free swimming stage. However, warmer water holds less oxygen, which may stress your fish (add an extra air stone if you think O2 is a problem). Higher temps also cause loose food and fish poop to decay faster and polute the water faster. Last, if you are not treating the ich correctly, i.e. the wrong kind of medication or too little of the right kind, the high temp will just speed up the life cycle and it will attack the fish with increased vigor.

I hope you are not putting any medication in a reef tank. As many people will tell you from their own mistakes, the "reef safe" stuff is not really reef safe at all!

If this is a fish only tank, I recommend hyposalinity...it is very effective and natural.

If you can catch any of the fish, a freshwater dip will get rid of what is eating them right now, but they will become reinfected once put back in the tank.

What size is the tank?
What's in it?
What kind of fish and which ones are affected?
How is water quality?

All of these factors will help people determine a good course of treatment for you.

Good luck.

 

[JD'sReef]

The reason I thought it was my starfish was because I have had the other fish in my 29 for a long time now, and the ich came after I put the star in. However with that aside, it is a 46bow with a 10 gallon sump. All together i would say that I only have about 40-45 gallons or water with all the rock and sand. It is not really a full reef tank as I only have live rock and some mushrooms.
I amd using Kent RXP and it says that it is reef safe pluss I am not using the full dosage. Basically it says to dose everyother day and reather then that I am trying to dose 1/3rd of the recomended dosage everyday.
The corals are not waving in the current like they normally do however they are not closed up or spewing either. As for fish I have a to Ocel Clowns and yellow tang, fire gobe and something that looks like a mangro snapper (found him in Florida when he was only the size of a pin head).
As of last night, only the tang still has spots on his tail and pectoral fins everyone else seems to be doing real good. I think that If i keep using this method it will just keep the Ich under controll untill it runs its cycle.
All pramaters are normal, and Ph is up around 8.2.
Any other sugestions?
Thanks J.

 

[Anonymous]

If she put in the shop's tank water it is very possible that ich was introduced via this manner.

However, I honestly don't think it's a good idea to treat the display, I'm pushy when it comes to using quarantine tanks/containers. Please, seriously consider getting a Rubbermaid tub, an extra heater and sponge filter, treat the animals in there. (Yeah, I know, but eventually you really can get very good with a net!) Once you have your fish there, you can hit 'em with hyposalinity post freshwater dipping before introduction into q/t. (I'd also use methylene blue for the dipping, just enough to turn the water dark blue.) Then, let that tank go fallow for 6-8 weeks and you ought to be successful starving out the C. irritans. (Although I had some troublesome correspondences with a fellow in Australia early this month who'd fallowed over 14 weeks, STILL having trouble with ich! Eek!)

When you increase the tank temp, you're speeding up the life cycle of the parasite, so yes, it's right along the lines of what's done with freshwater ich, but that doesn't necessarily translate into the treatment going along faster.

 

[Jet-Puffed]

The only thing I would add seamaiden is to reduce the salinity of the QT over a 24 to 48 hour period.

Agree that the only way to break the cycle is to treat seperatly and let the main tank go fallow.

 

[Anonymous]

Welcome, JetP'd.. (like the Sta-Puft Marshmallow man?.. who actually resembles the Michelin man..?). You're right, I did leave that bit out, being in a hurry does that, eh?

 

[JD'sReef]

Thanks Guys
Seamaddin, I am going to do what you said, but is that really the only filtration I would need for the 'Sick Tank'.
Also, what were those two chemicals you mentioned. I have never heard anything about them and I am intrested.
Thanks Again
J.

 

[Anonymous]

Yes, it is. However, it needs to either be seeded with nitrifying bacteria, or you'll have to control ammonia and nitrite buildup with water changes (it's always a good idea to siphon the bottom of the q/t daily to remove as many dropped parasites as possible. Lots of folks do this with a bit of airline tubing for control).

The methylene blue is most commonly used with freshwater, to help prevent fungal growth on eggs. However, it's good to use when freshwater dipping for several reasons. Should be easy to find at the LFS. I don't recollect what other chemical I may have mentioned.. however, going hyposaline means you need to take the salinity down to around 1.010, possibly even as low as 1.007. Ask Manny about the importance of having precise, reliable tools to measure salinity!

http://www.wetwebmedia.com/dips_baths.htm

 

[Jet-Puffed]

Thanks for the welcome. Interestingly enough, when I was on vacation in Norway this summer, marshmallows are one of the few things that are actually imported from the US. I have no idea what they use them for, I had to introduce them to the concept of Smores.

Anyway, I currently have a Flame in hyposalinity (actually started as QT, but he developed ich--shows the importance of a QT). What I do is slowly lower the salinity from about 1.025 to 1.009 over a two day period, usually by replacing 1 gal at a time with RO water. I also buffer it by adding a little baking soda to the RO water. You need to have a good refractometer to do this, you can get a cheap one off ebay for about $50.

Keep it at this level for three weeks after you see the last cyst drop off, and you should be good to go. Watch the levels, especially NH4 and pH and do water changes every so often.

Hope this helps.

 

[Anonymous]

Quite helpful.

Diggin' the new av, too. (Talk to SpaceAce, I betcha he can animate that thing for you!)

 

[liquid]

Have you checked this issue of Advanced Aquarist? http://www.advancedaquarist.com/ Terry B is writing a series on ich.

Shane

 

[Terry B]

JD,
I see that you are in good hands. I just wanted to add that I agree that you should not add chemical treatments for ich to a reef. Reef safe medications are not very effective anyway. As Shane mentioned, I did write a 5 part series on ich for Advanced Aquarist Online magazine. Part one doesn't get into the treatments, but you may find the information useful at some point.
Good luck,
Terry B

 

[Terry B]

Seamaiden,
I don't want to hijack this thread, but I would be interested in hearing about your friend in Australia and his struggle. Perhaps you would email me? [email protected]
Thanks,
Terry B

 

[JD'sReef]

Wow Guys
Thank you for all of the help, this has been very benificial. I do have one last concern though. Do I have to take a fish out that isn't infected. From what I have read, the ich lives in the sand bed, and it stays alive for a Min of 30 days. I took out all of my fish except for one FireFly Gobe. He is to fast and I would have to rip apart my entire tank to get him out. He never get ich and does not have one spot on him. Can I leave him in the reef? Also, after the fish are healthy, how do I know that the Reef is clean as well?
Thanks and I hope you all had a nice Holiday.
J.

 

[Anonymous]

Terry, you have an email.

JD, honestly, with any vertebrate upon which the ich could attach itself (and being the main display), the only way that I could comfortably say that you have your best chance of being ich free is if this fish is removed, and then the fallowing continues for a minimum of 6 weeks. Yes, even if he's shown no signs (though I'm no expert, this is just my opinion.. and me being wary).

In my own opinion, I would think that the tank being fallowed for 8 weeks, at a temp of 79F-80F, it ought to be free of parasites.