Yeah, I still got it.

[Anonymous]

It's not exactly "bull-crap". Can you grow corals without live rock? Yes. Can you grow them with live rock? Yes.

 

[Anonymous]

The only thing you can get three reefers to agree on it that the fourth guy's doing it wrong. Not why he is wrong, only that he is wrong.



(an old proverb stolen from another hobby)

 

[Mihai]

It's not exactly "bull-crap". Can you grow corals without live rock? Yes. Can you grow them with live rock? Yes.

Nope, the question was not about LR or not, but rather about feeding intentionally or not...

I guess that Galeon will figure it out for the rest of us, one way or the other.

I also do not disagree with Galeon - I don't feel competent to do that. I was just repeating like a broken tape what I read about keeping corals and asking for details in what I find an interesting discussion (you notice that I rarely get into beaslebob's threads for example).

M.

 

[Anonymous]

Great thread, Galleon!

How important do you think the skimmer is if you don't have any nutrient input?

 

[Anonymous]

So Galleon, what are you planning to do for Ca and Alk dosing? Cool setup BTW...

Calcium chloride and sodium carbonate dissolved in RO topoff water.

You can mix those together in ro water without any problems? How do you know how much to dissolve in? Is there any substantial difference between sodium carbonate and sodium bicarbonate?

 

[Anonymous]

Great thread, Galleon!

How important do you think the skimmer is if you don't have any nutrient input?

I do though. Bacteria fix nitrogen and take up phosphates from the PVC/fiberglass/plastic. That's new nutrients going into the system. It's mainly another method of maintaining tight control of the system.

 

[Anonymous]

You can mix those together in ro water without any problems?

No, separate containers of RO water. If you mix them together, they'll precipitate out.

How do you know how much to dissolve in?

Formulas and experience.

Is there any substantial difference between sodium carbonate and sodium bicarbonate?

Yes. Two reasons. First, At the pH of seawater, bicarbonate and carbonate are in about a ten to one ratio, respectively. If you add bicarbonate (HCO3-), it will lose its last proton (H+) to form carbonate (CO3--) to maintain this ratio, actually lowering the pH. Adding CO3-- means that to maintain the ratio, CO3-- must take up a proton to form HCO3-, raising the pH.

Secondly, Both CO3-- and HCO3- will raise the carbonate alkalinity, however, one CO3-- counts twice as much as one HCO3-, since CO3-- can take up 2 protons to HCO3-'s one. (Both will buffer seawater by taking up protons to form H2CO3).

 

[Anonymous]

Nice Galleon!

What do you think about ozone in hobby reef tanks?

You like UV, what do you think about running it on a tank with sand? Losing battle?

 

[Anonymous]

That is a hell of a setup, Chris.

I don't think it would look all that good in my living room. I like the look of live rock.

I wonder if a setup like this would grow frags out to market size any quicker than a standard reef with LR, LS, fish, etc.?

I would build one in my fish room out of site of my main display.

I'm gonna build one of those eductor skimmer one day. I saw one of Galleons in person at Mote when I visited last summer. It's a skimming machince for sure.

Louey

 

[Anonymous]

BTW - I have been thinking about plumbing a similar system into my main system for grow out.

 

[Anonymous]

Nice Galleon!

What do you think about ozone in hobby reef tanks?

My only experience with ozone is on an industrial scale, in systems over 100,000 gallons. We use UV on smaller systems because ozone breaks down PVC and is always a risk in a closed space. Not to mention, UV leaves little if any residual material (ie hydrogen peroxide), no matter how fast you run water through it. Not the case with ozone. UV is also generally better at breaking down photoreactive things like certain coral secondary compounds.

You like UV, what do you think about running it on a tank with sand? Losing battle?

I would really like UV on a tank with sand. It'll still help with coral chemicals and keeping potentially pathogenic bacteria that may take over easily when/if corals become stressed due to organics/etc. in the sand in check.

 

[Anonymous]

I wonder if a setup like this would grow frags out to market size any quicker than a standard reef with LR, LS, fish, etc.?

Fertilized corals grow slower

 

[Anonymous]

Picture from a day or so ago.

Frag species are:

Acropora cervicornis
Montastrea cavernosa
Diploria labyrinthiformis
Porites porites

 

[Mihai]

They look cool. Quick question: the rightmost frag stays on the side (it was like this in your first picture too). Is it intentional? Will it grow in cool shapes, attach faster or something else?

M.

 

[Anonymous]

I don't mean to imply that you are wrong - you obviously have much more experience than I do and I cannot make such a statement, I rather have a problem deciding between your oppinion's and Calfo's for example.

Hey, that's your call.

If it would be to find a flaw in your logic is the fact that you do not mention any quantities: you say that C and N come from the air and are made available in the form of bacteria to the corals. Perhaps true, but they may be available in sufficient quantities, or, perhaps 1000 less than what they need.

C and N are unlimited (photosynthesis/N fixation). There will be more P than necessary from all the plastics.

Regarding softies and LPS I refer to the fleashy corals that have more than the 2 cell-width bodies and may need more energy (food) to live than your typical SPS...

No coral is thicker than 2 cell layers. And I don't keep corals that need to be fed.

 

[Anonymous]

They look cool. Quick question: the rightmost frag stays on the side (it was like this in your first picture too). Is it intentional? Will it grow in cool shapes, attach faster or something else?

M.

Doesn't really matter. Just easier to glue larger branches sideways. They'll encrust and sprout new axial corallites.

 

[Mihai]

Thanks for taking the time. Please keep us posted 6 months from now, I'm really looking forward to the results of this experiment. Maybe I'm pushing it, but given how much grief I gave you, can you pm me if I don't notice your update 6 months from now (I get really busy at times and can't check all the threads)?

Thanks,
Mihai

 

[Anonymous]

Is it an experiment? I understood that that is basically the way lots of 'aquariums' propagate corals.

 

[Anonymous]

Is it an experiment? I understood that that is basically the way lots of 'aquariums' propagate corals.

I've never seen another public aquarium do it this way. At least not with Caribbeans/Atlantics. Most of them are still into the ecosystem thing.

But, it's not an experiment. Been doing it this way for seven years.

I lost (by lose I mean I was forced to break it down) my culture system two years ago due to space and electrical constraints. The mother colonies of the species I had were on display and most of the frags I sent to our sister lab. I did keep a few to grow out in the displays. I just got the ok a few weeks ago to set the culture system back up again, albeit on a smaller scale. This is the result.

 

[Anonymous]

Hey Galleon, I thought of another question I might ask you.

Why Sodium Carbonate and Calcium Chloride to replace evaporation instead of Kalk?