Ich and its effects on the whole aquarium

[CC-Star]

My question comes from what happened in this post (background) http://www.reefs.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=64248
Tittled "Yellow Tang Harassing Flame Angel"

My Flame Angel has came down with Ich
(Symptoms: white specs (like salt) on body and fins...not much but some)
He is NOT: having laboured breathing, itching himself on rocks, or lathargic)
He did not have it when I placed him into the tank but sure enough in day day of being harassed by the Yellow tangs the spots appeared. I have since caught him and put in him my QT tank.

I have admistered Cupramine...
I also lowered the salinity not to much but less than the display tank

I was wondering what the sucess has been by using this medication?
I was also wondering if there is a chance of the other fish (2xpercs, 1-goby, 1-gramma, 1-Yellow Tang) getting this (ich)?

 

[ChrisRD]

It's been many years since I've had to medicate a fish, but copper and hyposalinity seem to be the preferred ich treatments these days. I don't think lowering the salinity slightly will help much (has to be down near SG=1.009 IIRC), but the copper alone will probably do the trick.

As for the other fish in your display tank, yes there's a chance they will contract it now. Unfortunately, once the ich parasite is in the main tank, the only way I know of to (possibly) erradicate it without killing the wrong stuff along with it would be to keep the system fallow (no fish) for an extended period of time. The theory is that without a host you will eventually break the life cycle of the parasite. I think 6 weeks is the common guideline, but more would probably be better.

Personally, I wouldn't do anything different than what you're doing now unless other fish start showing symptoms. It sounds like the parasite was already in the system, and if the other fish haven't showed symptoms up to now, they may not have a problem. IME a well fed, healthy fish can often fight off a mild case with no treatment.

JMO...

 

[CC-Star]

Thanks for the response! Very much appreciated.

So far the main tank everyone looks healthy and happy. But I will keep an even closer eye out for weeks to come just incase. Especially with stressing them out and moving all the rock.

The Flame Angel so far is moving around eating and happy in the QT tank. Still has ich on him (after day 1) not sure how long it takes to clear up? Anyone have any guidance/experiences to share (esp using Cuparmine)?

 

[CC-Star]

How long does it take to clear ich up in a QT tank using Cuparmine?????
It has been 5 days since he has been in the QT tank...and he has cleared up some spots, and then just as I think he was all cleared up there is one on his side and still his fins have some. The medication just says to apply 20 drops (2 drops per 1 gallon) once and then again 48 hours later and that is it....but what happens if he is not clearing up?? Does it take long??

 

[ChrisRD]

To be honest, it's been about 10 years since I've treated a fish with copper, and I can't ever remember using cupramine, but if you don't see positive results in the next few days you might consider lowering the salinity gradually for hypo treatment.

I'll move this into the GRD where some of the fish experts can probably help you...

HTH

 

[phk361]

If you have a qt tank use coper it will work very fast .Make sure to follow as directed and check coper levels with a test kit.

 

[CC-Star]

Thanks,

He is still swimming around (happy looking), and not breathing crazy heavy, eating habits are good - hungry guy, and does not seem to be itching himself.

The salinity is lower (1.017) than the main tank (1.023), and its been almost a week he has been in the QT w. the Cuparmine.

For the first days he seemed to drop his white spots, but then now his 3 main fins are more like blurry patches, and i just noticed this morning his one eye on the corner is blurry. Is that a bad sign - as in is that the second stages of growth, is he not going to kick this parasite?? He still has the odd small white dot on his body (like 4-5). Anyone with some experience/knowledge on this would be extremely helpful, as I am growing fustrated/worried that this guy will not kick it...

 

[CC-Star]

Well what a fustrating week....and weekend....
It is so disheartening watching a fish just wither away....so suxs in the worst way, so helpless or so it seems.

He now looks like he hhas this blurry thing on his eye, all his fins (which one he seems to not want to use as often as the other not crazy noticeable but still), and two white bloches now...not the usual white "sand/salt" specs that were earlier viewed on him earlier in the week. I just see him going down hill and I just cant seem to do anything about it. GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRrr

I just checked the water..sure enough nitrates are high....grr..so vaccumed the bottm, changed almost 7/8 of the water w. pure RO water...and psft....still some level of nitrates exsist. I have the salinity at 1.012-1.013. Then temp around 80.... i added some more cuparmine...but still. Sigh...suxs he is so awesome looking, he was going to be a awesome addition to the tank. Suxs watching a fish die...man...wish there were such things as fish doctors in the area.

 

[Anonymous]

Is he breathing heavy? Is he eating? What about the pH of the water...what is it?

 

[CC-Star]

He is a hungry bear all the time, he seems to be breathing alright...

Ph ..just checked....low.7.9 ddddddddddddddarnit..(then again that is bc i pretty much just filled it w. RO/DI water...so i just put pH buffer in it......not sure if that will do it might have to dump some of that water and add stuff from the main tank).

 

[CC-Star]

Sigh

Guess 2morrow get another heater this one just doesnt seem to be staying at one place....and find some way to get the pH higher.

(Not sure why still shows nitrates when I pretty much EMPTYIED the tank and put RO/DI water in...that just boggles my mind)

My luck it will be all to late...

 

[Anonymous]

The important thing is to keep your QT stable...we don't want to add to the stress. I would suggest small, frequent water changes as opposed to big ones. If most of the water in your QT is new, but your nitrates are still high, your test kits may be garbage. Pick up a Salifert kit when you get a new heater...your nitrates may be just fine.

Adding a little 2 part solution should get your pH up where it should be. Also keep in mind that pH tends to fall when the lights go out.

If he's eating and breathing fine, don't give up hope. Work on stabilizing the QT. Don't overfeed, either. Good luck...please keep us posted.

 

[CC-Star]

Gotcha, thanks for the suggestion in regards to the small water changes, and pH....

Will keep you updated...poor lil' flamer :/

 

[CC-Star]

FISH IS BETTER!!! WHOOHOOO
Once we bought a new heater it cleared right up the next day....so far for 4 days he has been clear and happy. So the Cuparmine, balenced high temp, water changes and lower salnity has cured this guy right up.

We are going to leave him in there still for another week. Then probably going to return my yellow grumpy aggressive tang from my display to the LFS before we put the flame angel in there....

Unfortuntly we have to move this month so yikes scared of that...we have bought some large 20 gal plastic tubs. In most tubs we are going to be rocks and fish in, and a powerhead, and two tubs two anemones w. power heads. Not sure what to do about the sand bed (is it safe to just dump and then replace it). Do we just dump all the water back into the tank and the rock and then place the fish in or do we have to cycle the tank or anything crazy?? Anyone with experience in regards to moving a tank your input would be helpful. So do not want to lose anything.
(We are just moving 5-10 minutes from here but moving the tank etc will probably take a better part of the day)

 

[silly34]

Unfortuntly we have to move this month so yikes scared of that...we have bought some large 20 gal plastic tubs. In most tubs we are going to be rocks and fish in, and a powerhead, and two tubs two anemones w. power heads. Not sure what to do about the sand bed (is it safe to just dump and then replace it). Do we just dump all the water back into the tank and the rock and then place the fish in or do we have to cycle the tank or anything crazy?? Anyone with experience in regards to moving a tank your input would be helpful. So do not want to lose anything.
(We are just moving 5-10 minutes from here but moving the tank etc will probably take a better part of the day)

When I moved my 125g I got a 100g sump from the local feed store and kept all of the tank water. I then got 3 larger tubs (rubbermaid) and bagged up all of my fish and corals seperately. I then placed all of my rockwork in a tub with wet newspaper. Once everything was out of the tank I took all of the sand and put that in a tub.

Once I got the tank relocated I just put the sand and rock back, pumped in the water and re-acclimated the fish and corals until the temperature was the same. Never had anything die.

Good luck and take your time!

B.

 

[fishfanatic2]

An increase in temperature makes the parasite reproduce faster, which is good since the copper was there to kill it as well as the low salinity.

Good to hear!

 

[Joew]

Don't trust this getting better trust me, ich is always present from what i understand. Even read some info about it remaining in a no fish populated tank. Not sure how true it is. I think you should qt/copper anyway.

JoeW
_________________
Honda Fit

 

[CC-Star]

THanks for the tips Silly34 that is really helpful. My moving friends will want to thank you as well ehehe. Do you think its a bad idea to replace some of the sand with new sand? Not all of it but adding more to it.


Yupper so far the flame angel is doing awesome...and its been 3, almost 4 weeks in the QT tank and for more than a week he has been doing awesome. So this weekend we are gonna put him back in the main tank (remove mr. grumpy yellow before we put him the tank). And continue to watch the tank to make sure no ich pops back up again, especially after the move.

 

[fishfanatic2]

Don't trust this getting better trust me, ich is always present from what i understand. Even read some info about it remaining in a no fish populated tank. Not sure how true it is. I think you should qt/copper anyway.

JoeW

Very big argument on this. Some swear its always there, others say its not.

 

[silly34]

THanks for the tips Silly34 that is really helpful. My moving friends will want to thank you as well ehehe. Do you think its a bad idea to replace some of the sand with new sand? Not all of it but adding more to it.

No should'nt be a problem because if you keep some of the old sand and of course adding the live rock the new sand will quickly get the bacteria it needs too keep the nitrite in check.

B.