Canisters - Any positive points?

[Oceans Ferevh]

I've heard that canister filters can be great as a "vacume" for when you're blowing stuff off the rocks and sand with a turkey baister or power head.

 

[Oceans Ferevh]

At least as a temp use thing

 

[Anonymous]

Bob, I have been chatting on another forum & a simple solution that was suggested was to wash the media in the canister every 1 or 2 weeks and only use it for mechanical filtration. Small bit of work for a nice clean/clear tank cant be to much to ask. Then lots of live rock/sand for biological & then a skimmer. That should do it, or will i need more? chemical?

Pop, a reufgium would require a sump & therefore make the canister issue not relevant.

The quest continues.

As long as your live rock has lotsa plant life on it yes. But live sand works through anaerobic/anoxic bacterial action. When things are working the end product is simply nitrogen gas. It uses low oxygen bacteria which start with nitrates then to nitrites then ammonia then nitrogen gas. If that process breaks down the result is ammonia and possibly sulfides. the ammonia is effectively an increased bioload further taxing the DSB. Not a stable situation. Plus the sand does nothing to remove toxins, ammonia directly, phosphates, and carbon dioxide.

By contrast plant life (even if that on live rock) consumes ammonia, nitrates, phosphates, and carbon dioxide. Plus bioaccumulates toxins and heavy metals like copper. all of which work much better in an aerobic environment to produce nitrates as fast as possible. Even if from a canister filter. And if something goes bump like a fish dieing, a filter not cleaned, or additional ammonia from a DSB, the plant life consumes the ammonia increase directly preventing cycles. A much more stable environment.

So like I said, if the LR has lotsa plant life then sure. To be really sure a refugium full of plant life will insure a stable system. Regardless of the condition of the lr/lr, whether or not a filter has been cleaned and so on.

 

[Anonymous]

Bottom line--if you're using a canister filter, the more often you can rinse out any mechanical media the better. You're effectively removing it from the system every time you do vs. leaving it an area of high water flow and oxygenation where it will quickly decompose. That is never a good thing.

 

[P Matt]

Bottom line--if you're using a canister filter, the more often you can rinse out any mechanical media the better. You're effectively removing it from the system every time you do vs. leaving it an area of high water flow and oxygenation where it will quickly decompose. That is never a good thing.

Exactly.

I don't know why Dark Stranger is so intent on using a canister filter when their are proven alternatives out there.

It is startling to see the lack of knowledge concerning the nitrogren cycle, and nutrient export that most new reefkeepers have. The more you understand these processes in both the aquarium and on the reef, the easier it is to design and maintain your captive system.

Good luck with your set up D.S.

 

[dark_stranger]

I don't know why Dark Stranger is so intent on using a canister filter when their are proven alternatives out there.

Well being a "new reefkeeper" as you put it, I am trying to establish the best way of doing something with in the scope of my knowledge & tank spec. The tank i plan to get may not have a big enough space in the cabinet to house a sump (seems to be ther prefered method) & therefore just checking out my options.

It is startling to see the lack of knowledge concerning the nitrogren cycle, and nutrient export that most new reefkeepers have.

Sorry to point out the obvious, but I dont need to as you already have. Being a "new reefkeeper" or a new anything means a lack of knowledge & therefore questions are asked to build up the knowledge. This is what being a beginner is all about. Its a learning process.

Good luck with your set up D.S.

Cheers mate, still have many decisions to make, but its a marathon, not a sprint.

 

[P Matt]

Sorry if I came off kind of like a jerk. That was a stream of consciousness post. You are already ahead of the game by researching before you spend your dough. I suppose my point was that understanding the basics will make your desicions much easier.

Have fun.

-Matt

 

[Anonymous]

I don't know why Dark Stranger is so intent on using a canister filter when their are proven alternatives out there.

Well being a "new reefkeeper" as you put it, I am trying to establish the best way of doing something with in the scope of my knowledge & tank spec. The tank i plan to get may not have a big enough space in the cabinet to house a sump (seems to be ther prefered method) & therefore just checking out my options.

It is startling to see the lack of knowledge concerning the nitrogren cycle, and nutrient export that most new reefkeepers have.

Sorry to point out the obvious, but I dont need to as you already have. Being a "new reefkeeper" or a new anything means a lack of knowledge & therefore questions are asked to build up the knowledge. This is what being a beginner is all about. Its a learning process.

Good luck with your set up D.S.

Cheers mate, still have many decisions to make, but its a marathon, not a sprint.

right on brother 8) :wink:

we all were new to this at some point.
if the lack of sump space is triggering the canister filter concern, it doesn't matter.
a sump is just handy... that is why they are preferred. the selection of equipment is much broader and the end result is cleaner (looking that is).

if you can't manage one for one reason or another i would suggest you look at HOT (hang on tank) skimmers.
they are much better for a reeftank than a canister and they are easier to maintain.
if you have the room for a canister that will be vacant in the off chance that you decide against buying one, i suggest you use the space for a closed loop pump circuit.
it will clean up the tanks look by eliminating powerheads inside the tank and could be used for a sump that might be in your future.

 

[dark_stranger]

Sorry if I came off kind of like a jerk. That was a stream of consciousness post. You are already ahead of the game by researching before you spend your dough. I suppose my point was that understanding the basics will make your desicions much easier.

Have fun.

-Matt

No worries, I am just trying to gauge what is the best option & find it hard to understand why canisters are developed, sold & brought if they are such an ineffective method of filtration. Plus they seem such a good idea in theroy, but in practice, from common concensious they have a negative rather positive effect on the tanks water cycle.

 

[dark_stranger]

right on brother 8) :wink:

we all were new to this at some point.
if the lack of sump space is triggering the canister filter concern, it doesn't matter.
a sump is just handy... that is why they are preferred. the selection of equipment is much broader and the end result is cleaner (looking that is).

if you can't manage one for one reason or another i would suggest you look at HOT (hang on tank) skimmers.
they are much better for a reeftank than a canister and they are easier to maintain.
if you have the room for a canister that will be vacant in the off chance that you decide against buying one, i suggest you use the space for a closed loop pump circuit.
it will clean up the tanks look by eliminating powerheads inside the tank and could be used for a sump that might be in your future.

Hi, aside from the canister i was planning on having a deltac skimmer working in conjunction with the canister, but from ur comments could i use either on or the other. Saying that, is a skimmer a mechanical skimmer & therefore a canister is not required? The more i read, the more i get confused.

Ok, summary. Protien skimmers take out larger particals (mechanical) & liverock (biological). Therefore in theory (i like the saying in theory as in theory anything can work) would this filtration work. I was looking at getting a deltec mce 600 hang on skimmer, but have just read about bubbles returning into the tank & also a smell problem with the gunk produced. I may have to just wait till i get the tank & then measure the sump space to see if i can fit a sump.

What is a closed loop pump circuit, do you know of any diagrams?

Thanks for all your patience in answering my questions.

 

[carsimex]

I am way to new in this (8+ month) and can only talk from my own experience. 44 G tank with ~50lb LR; running 24/7 AquaC Remora Hang-On with MaxiJet 1200; Cascade 1500 Canister Filter running 24/7 as well. I do religiosity clean the canister filter every 2, 3 weeks and there is a lot of stuff accumulates in there. Also I do 5% weekly water changes. Water parameters are not perfect but it is stable and good. The life in the tank is thriving and I see that everyone who lives in there are happy. The bottom line is: every type of filtration and piece of equipment is going to work only when you are using it the right way. Everything is depending on your personal attention and amount of work you are willing to put into it. I am learning the business as I do it and one day I WILL get sump / refuge but for now this is all I can afford. We all learn from our mistakes but the smart ones learn on mistakes of others.

 

[Anonymous]

You do not need the canister filter. For a reef tank, the skimmer is more important. If you don't mind using the canister for circulation, sure. In my smaller tanks I use a HOB skimmer and a HOB filter for circulation. The HOB filter gives all the benefits of the canister, but is better in that you can change, add, remove the filter media without shutting off and opening the canister.