Help me think through a 100g cube setup.

[SnowManSnow]

Help me think through this. If you see somthing listed that I can pick up for cheaper chime in! If it looks like I'm making a mistake CHIME IN! hehe.

Heres the direction I'm leaning at the current hour.

Aquarium = 100g cube from www.glasscages.com cost= $315
http://www.glasscages.com/?sAction=ViewCat&lCatID=2

Lighting = 400w Hamilton Reefstar Pendant from www.hellolights.com
Cost = apx $340 with bulb.
http://www.hellolights.com/400wahqirelo.html

Skimmer = UP IN THE AIR for now. Because of cost issues I MAY try to get bye with my AquaC remora thats powered with a MJ1200. I'm more of a coral guy than a fish guy. Only 2 fish right now so load is light.

Well, thats the aquarium, lighting, and skimmer solution on my mind. The rest is pretty much peanuts.

I know there will be someone to suggest a sump, but again because of cost I'd rather keep it all HOT if possible. By the time u create a sump, throw a skimmer in there, flood the carpet, it adds up. (may do it just not sure yet.. not the flooding part).

HELP ME OUT HERE GUYS!

THANKS
B

 

[Anonymous]

Hi there,

Looks like a good plan to me. I have a 120 that was originally going to be a cube, but is actually more of a peninsula. You will LOVE the cube style though. Having three full sized viewing areas just can't be beat!

Your light and tank both look fine.

Now, as you expected, I'm going to recommend you go with a sump. I'll put it in parenthesis, in case you want to ignore it...
(((They can actually be done very cheaply, with just a rubbermaid type container. That's how I've done mine and it's worked great. Don't be too concerned that a sump will raise your chances of a flood, as I don't think it will. In addition to increasing your total water volume and system stability, a sump can help you keep equipment out of sight.)))

And with a beautiful cube tank, the less equipment visible the better, right?

What will you do for circulation? Maybe consider a closed loop.

Have Fun!

 

[Unarce]

With a tall cube, the 400W DE pendant will be fine. If you end up getting a wide cube, the spread will suck. You'll want to consider a SE with a spider reflector, or better yet, a Lumenarc.

 

[SnowManSnow]

I thought I knew what it was.. but someone please explain what a "closed loop is!"

Thanks!

B

BTW.. considering a 100g cube that is 30x30x25. Thats not too much of a spread is it?

 

[SnowManSnow]

Ok i want to go with a sump, i know its best thing to do, (I've learned to do things you WONT regret later in this hobby). Should I have it drilled on the back side on the bottom in the center with a built in overflow?

Thing is, when I call to order my tank I dont wanna look like an idot. What do I need for a sump overflow and what size holes .. ect....

What about the closed loop thing. DO I need more holes for that? and what size and where?

Someone give me an Idea and I'll see if i can diagram it to make sure I understand it right.

Thanks!

b

 

[trigger0214]

Dude..a closed loop is just a way to swirl water around your tank - with no openings in the loop (i.e. no sump). You would need to run an externally driven pump, as water and electrical motors don't tend to mix.

You can also put in some cool little gadgets in the loop while your at it.....micron filter, UV sterilizer, heater cartridge, solenoids to alter water currents, etc,....AND...if you are drilling the tank anyway, you don't really have to worrry about an overflow since no water can escape the loop. By this I mean that the water enters the loop - most likely throught a bulk head dirlled through the glass and returns to the tank through another bulkhead - so, if the power goes out, the pump stops, that's it.

In the end, it accomplishes the same thing (if you have the gadgets elsewhere). Only thing, with a sump you have a nice place to hide that giant skimmer which you will undoubtedly have (an open skimmer would violate the CLOSED part of the closed loop...) and extra water capacity. The extra water capicity is great for things like refugiums - should you believe in them.

 

[cindre2000]

I got my 30 gallon acrylic cube from glasscages. Looks great. It also would be a decent sump (20*20*16), only $70.

As for the overflow. Figure out how much flow you want going through the tank. I believe most people believe in gph = gph of the skimmer or 10 times the tank volume. The closed loop should to the rest. I feel the best way to deal with the overflow with as little noise as possible is use at least two. I have two 1" on my 30 since I am too lazy for a closed loop. But I could still throw one on with no trouble.

So, two 1.5" overflows and a pump that can get at least 1200 gph at what ever head?

Your closed loop will probably be plumped through your overflow (another good reason for a full overflow that goes through the bottom); depending what you plan on keeping, 20-40 times the flow is pretty good. If you spread it out enough, there should not be one very very fast stream. The size of the holes depends on the bulkhead built to match the pump. You should pick your pump first so you know whether you need 1/2", 3/4" or more. Since you will have only a foot of head or so, this pump will be cheaper (most likely) than the one in the sump. Make sure it is quite enough!


So IMO, you will need a overflow that will hold two 1.5" bulkheads with druso standpipes. Behind the overflow you can drill the hole for the the external pump. 1/2", 3/4", or what ever. Then you can drill a couple of holes in the back wall (unless you want to drape it all over the side). Remember one return is from the sump.

 

[Rob Top]

When you call glasscages, they can guide you through the overflow placement and size, holes for a closed loop ect ect. Don't feel like you don't know. The guy is very nice, unless you cross him, so don't poke the bear and he will be a world of help. Couple questions. What size tank do you have now? Could that be your sump? If so you could keep your HOT skimmer. Also I would add a closed loop, I prefer them to a bunch of power heads for flow.

 

[SnowManSnow]

current tank is 37g , but its a pretty tall tank and I think id rather have a shallower sump.

B

 

[cindre2000]

I think I will add a little more to what I said...

You have decided the tank you want (an excellent choice too) and you are going to use a 400 watt metal halide (which is about 6 inches too short when it comes to spread).

I guess you will make the stand yourself? I suggest setting up a "cabinet" behind the tank to hide the closed loop and possibly your electrics.

Careful thought to the circulation is a must when it comes to cubes. In longer tanks, you do not have to worry so much about the flow along the depth. This is where the closed loop is important. Your return should not be pumping a huge amount of water since you waste a whole bunch of energy b/c of the head (which is why I am elevating my sump!). Your closed loop should provide most of the flow.

You could get fancy and plumb some of the returns from the closed loop through the back wall or the bottom; however, I see two problems with this. First; you are drilling more holes in the tank and paying for lots of bulkheads = expensive. Second, if the power fails, the closed loop will cause a minor syphon (unless there is a check valve), it will not drain the tank completly; however, it will drain it to the level of the standpipe, which is bad. When the returns are placed above the tank, you don't pay for the drilling; and the overflow level can be different from your main display.

Your closed loop can be enhaced various way. The simpilest way is to have more than one return. This of course, drops the flow rate out of each return. A second common modification is to apply a wavemaker- you could have several closed loops; or multipul pumps that change the flow every couple of minutes. A better way to do this is with the Oceans Motions Super Sea Squirt, which will change the flow for you without turning on and off pumps.

One other, and far less used method of random surges of water, is through a surge device. Basically you have a large reservoir of water above the tank. When the bucket gets too full, a syphon kicks in and empties the water into the tank faster than the bucket is refilled. The main issues with this method is space (large bucket of water!), noise, bubbles, and flow. Few people have room for a surge bucket on a tank (I still have to install mine). Surges are usually loud due to the water rushing in; also, large amounts of bubbles can be formed at the begining and end of the syphoning period. Finally, your overflow has to be able to handle 10 or more gallons suddenly getting dumped in your tank without overflowing. Often a timer is useful to turn the surge off at night of a top off device and noise. Deeper sumps must also be used to be able to hold all the water after the bucket is empty

Now jumping over to your light setup, are you just useing one metal halide, or in combination with T5's, VHO, or Power Compact?

 

[Rob Top]

Second, if the power fails, the closed loop will cause a minor syphon (unless there is a check valve), it will not drain the tank completly; however, it will drain it to the level of the standpipe, which is bad.

A closed loop will not siphon and drain anything. It is closed, no where for the water to go except the tank

 

[cindre2000]

Actually it will if you set it up like I mentioned. If the closed loop pulls water from the overflow, and returns the water below the waterline; the water level in the main tank will equalize with the water in the overflow compartment when the pump is not running. It will not drain the tank compleltly; however, if the stand pipes are low; this may not be desirable.

 

[SnowManSnow]

I've seen some "hot" closed loops for tanks that aren't drilled...

Whats the downside of this?

B

 

[Anonymous]

I would think the downside to that would be just extra pipes outside the tank and in that aren't required if you are drilling anyway. If you have a HOT then the water in the pipes would flow back into the tank from the highest point in the pipe during power loss. Other than that I see no other difference other than asthetic.