Planning for large tank on 2nd floor

[rkaiser]

My gut is telling me this isn't a possibility, but since it would make a great place for a peninsula tank, I have to at least think it through.

I am looking at 2 tanks, a 60x30x30 or a 72x30x30, both starphire. I'd like to put it on the second floor, and run the plumbing into a room downstairs where I will have the sump/fuge, etc. I am not 100% sure on tank weight, but water around 2000+ lbs for water alone. Ofcourse the joists in the basement are not perpendicular, so I would only end up on 3.

The one pic I attached is of the double support beam. Above it, the back of the tank (30" side) would be against the wall it is supporting and is facing you in that pic.

The second pic, is the other side of the beam, where you are looking at the other 30" end of the tank above. (as you can see the joists are not running perpendicular to the long span of the tank)

I guess my general question is, can I sister the 3 joists and call it a day, or would I have to use a 5 foot support beam and two posts at the 4-5' mark of the length from the wall...or worst case, both?

I know in the end it will call for an engineer, but just trying to get general feedback. If need be, I could do something in the basement, but thats not finished yet, and it will be years before I would see that done, let alone a large tank down there.

Thanks for the help!

 

[huffnpuffer]

i would probably put up the the support beems to be on the safe side. between the weight of the water and then adding the rocks, etc. you will probably end off with close to 3000 pounds by the time you r finished. good luck

 

[albano]

Went thru this in 1990 for a 300g tank and again this year for my 450g...call an engineer! You will probably have to double up the joists and run a cross beam with 2 posts. A 300g glass reef tank with rock, sand, cabinet, and 2 or 3 people standing there looking at the tank, will be over 4000 lbs in less than 30 sq. ft.....as a side note do you really want the tank to be 30" deep (top to bottom), hard to clean, hard to light (for corals)...you will love the basement sump!

 

[cali_reef]

When you said second floor, do you mean you have another floor between the tank and the basement? I would be equally concern about the structure in between second and first floor, which can be constructed differently than the exposed first floor joist\beam.

 

[rkaiser]

Thanks for the input. I will definitely get an engineer. The 60x30x30 is one tank I found on the net, so the size is what it is. I just thought about adding more sand for a deeper bed

The 6' tank (my preferred) I am negotiating 24" tall, but I am getting quotes of close to 5K for 3 sided starphire. I wasn't expecting it to be that expensive, especially with the market being what it is.

Glasscages.com has a 72L x 36W x 25T roughly $1700 with 3-sided starphire, but concerned with quality since they are SOO much cheaper then other places.

Know anyone selling a peninsula starphire tank with similar dimensions?

 

[rkaiser]

2nd floor meaning the main floor above the basement, sorry about that. I am just used to people putting tanks like this in the basement due to the slab. The location for the tank would be great as its not getting alot of sun light, and its viewable from 90% of the first floor.

When you said second floor, do you mean you have another floor between the tank and the basement? I would be equally concern about the structure in between second and first floor, which can be constructed differently than the exposed first floor joist\beam.

 

[rkaiser]

This is where its going

The beam in the basement is what the wall behind my 28g is resting on. The joists will run Parallel to the new tank, whish is part of the issue. You can see this spot from the just about everywhere. The base will be built out of 2x4s or 2x6s replacing the tiny knee wall shown.

 

[18oreefer]

are your floor joists tji's (wooden i beams)? what is the top to bottom dimension of the joist?

 

[cali_reef]

How long are the floor joists and what are the dimensions on the beam(s)?

 

[rkaiser]

The joists are Georgia Pacific GPI40 9.5" tall I beams made of wood.
The Beams are (2) 12"x3.5" Anthony Power Beams Bolted together on the tank side of the room, soanning over to (1) 12"x3.5" power beam. There is a post in the vacinity of the tank on the double beam, so that might help weight a little.

The room is roughly 17 feet wide and the joists are 16" O.C.

 

[18oreefer]

if you place 2 lolly columns under the power beam close on either side of the 3 floor joists it should be fine on that side. down on the other side of the joist at the other end of the fish tank you would want to support that end. cut 2 2x10"'s that will span under all 3 tji's. nail the 2 2x10" togother. toe nail the 4x10" beam to under the 3 tji's. place a lolly column under each end of the 4x10 beam.... fill tank.

 

[rkaiser]

Good info thanks. I was hoping there was another way, since when I do finish the basement, that would put lolly columns in the largest open area I have down there :-(

I heard something about using Floor Trusses, &/or sistering the joists. Just not sure of the weight. Any possibility of that?

 

[cali_reef]

if you place 2 lolly columns under the power beam close on either side of the 3 floor joists it should be fine on that side. down on the other side of the joist at the other end of the fish tank you would want to support that end. cut 2 2x10"'s that will span under all 3 tji's. nail the 2 2x10" togother. toe nail the 4x10" beam to under the 3 tji's. place a lolly column under each end of the 4x10 beam.... fill tank.

This sounds like a pretty good and solid plan.

I would incorporate those columns\jacks into the fish room walls.

Not sure how one would sister I-beam type of joist, not much solid area to bolt\nail together. 17 feet is a pretty long span to prevent flexing.

 

[masterswimmer]

if you place 2 lolly columns under the power beam close on either side of the 3 floor joists it should be fine on that side. down on the other side of the joist at the other end of the fish tank you would want to support that end. cut 2 2x10"'s that will span under all 3 tji's. nail the 2 2x10" togother. toe nail the 4x10" beam to under the 3 tji's. place a lolly column under each end of the 4x10 beam.... fill tank.

I wouldn't even hesitate filling the tank after executing the above precaution. Very solid plan. If it were my home, I'd just be doing it without an engineer. But since this is YOUR home and not mine, I'll recommend you get an engineer :biggrin:

I've built many, many homes as a GC and this plan is rock solid. What's real nice about it is, TJI's lie true. Not like 2x10's/12's that can crown and your new short girder might not even touch all the joists above it. With TJI's, you can bet every one will sit square on the new short girder.

swimmer

 

[rkaiser]

Thanks for all the great info guys. I appreciate it. I assume the added beam would be best suited roughly 1 foot in from where the end of the tank will actually be? That would make it a bit stronger no?

 

[18oreefer]

1 ft in would work. if you wanted to maintain the open area you might be able to look into a steel flitch plate ( plate steel bolted in several places to the existing joist 1/4 or 3/8 thick) that you could add to the tji's. it would be a good deal of work to put them in but you should be able to maintain the span. it would cost a bit as well.