Most overpriced gadgets for reef hobby

[DEL]

That's nothing compared to GHL Profilux controllers. You had to buy everything separate. I got one used and ended up using it for nothing more than timers and pH. Ended up selling it years ago and made my money back. Yes I do know German stuff are better, but still. hahahaha. I'm happy with my reefkeeper

 

[bhazard451]

I like the wp40 I have and ordered a wp25 but they aren't nearly the same thing as vortechs. Controller looks nice. My mp10 has more modes sleeker. The wp has wave, else, and constant high and low?

At the end of the day it's like complaining why a Ferrari Cost the same as 10 civics. High end costs more because of the styling, performance, technology, material, craftsmanship, etc.

Not everyone needs to get it and you get it if you can afford it and justify it. I have an rkl for $150. Does everything I need.

Just my thoughts on it.

Tunze and Jebao pumps can both do the Vortech modes on a Reef Angel. The only differences are the pump on the outside and customer service at that point.

 

[FlyPenFly]

Tunze and Jebao pumps can both do the Vortech modes on a Reef Angel. The only differences are the pump on the outside and customer service at that point.

The only difference between a Ferrari and Civic are how fast it goes and how nice it looks.

The outside capability is the killer feature on the Vortech. No more added heat, A LOT less room in the tank.

 

[bhazard451]

The only difference between a Ferrari and Civic are how fast it goes and how nice it looks.

The outside capability is the killer feature on the Vortech. No more added heat, A LOT less room in the tank.

Not an applicable comparison. The comparable comparison is if my Mazdaspeed could do 0-60 in 3.6 seconds just like a Ferrari, at a quarter of the price, and not have the same looks or components as the Ferrari.

 

[FlyPenFly]

Not an applicable comparison. The comparable comparison is if my Mazdaspeed could do 0-60 in 3.6 seconds just like a Ferrari, at a quarter of the price, and not have the same looks or components as the Ferrari.

I can take a $100 junker and do the same thing... eventually so your Mazdaspeed is horribly overpriced especially for a FWD econobarge.

 

[Aqua Pro Builder]

As someone who has a degree in EE, I can tell you that designing, building, sourcing, contracting, and making the software for an APEX unit is a monumental task. The most expensive part of it will be writing good, dependable software then the next most expensive part is providing the level of support Neptune provides.

The actual manufacture of the physical parts themselves is trivial compared to those things but as someone who has contracted companies in China to build things, you'd be surprised how difficult that actually is to get great quality work with a low rejection rate.

Well it depends who is working on the project. I agreed the time spend on programming could be big especially when you hired the wrongly educated programmers. I did a dBase look alike in 1 week for a school project while Aston Tate has to remove most of his programmers because of the wrongful start in bad codes.

I found the quality of customer service of Apex is by chance. I helped couple guys in debugging their problems before and Apex tech have a tendency not to accept the fact that the product may be defective. For at least 2 cases, I tested the output of their VDM output wires(black and red) to be zero no matter what you do it the programming. They insisted that it's not a faulty unit and blame the DIY lights. The user have to borrow a working one from another reefer to proof it before they can accept return reluctantly.


Back to the original topic, I voted for wave pumps and lights too.

 

[Moneymaks24]

I don't agree that buying an apex is like choosing between a Ferrari or 10 civics. Ferrari gets all their us sales from 1,500 customers in the USA. That's out of like what 100,000,000. It's for the ultra rich to show status among quality ovs. A aquarium controller as you said is something almost all reefers need and it's not like its $5,000 where it's totally out of reach for us common non 80k a year people. I'm sure most can afford it if they save ( unlike Ferrari ) however a Ferrari costs a lot to make and it's unique and exotic and imported an hand made and a lot of things. An aquarium controller is supposed to be affordable, effective and reliable and not a status show piece that nobody but yourself sees anyway.

 

[Aqua Pro Builder]

That's nothing compared to GHL Profilux controllers. You had to buy everything separate. I got one used and ended up using it for nothing more than timers and pH. Ended up selling it years ago and made my money back. Yes I do know German stuff are better, but still. hahahaha. I'm happy with my reefkeeper

I don't how should I say it. I did sell their stuff and I feel the same as you, man.

LOL

 

[Moneymaks24]

Tunze and Jebao pumps can both do the Vortech modes on a Reef Angel. The only differences are the pump on the outside and customer service at that point.

Customer serve at jebao is awesome. They just paid $28 for shipping to send me a $10 replacement piece for free for my wp25 power control. I doubt that even the all mighty Eco tech wouldn't do that. Just saying

 

[Aqua Pro Builder]

Tunze and Jebao pumps can both do the Vortech modes on a Reef Angel. The only differences are the pump on the outside and customer service at that point.

Customer service can be improved a lot if they stop the group buy thing and established an US agent. No business in US wants to deal with their returns when they are still doing the group buy thing from China. That's the business model they cannot get away with. Since group buy is working for them, they don't want to rock the boat. And US vendors will not want to handle their problem unless they are guaranteed a market and get a good margin say $37 cost and $100 margin(exaggeration of course), LOL.

 

[bhazard451]

I can take a $100 junker and do the same thing... eventually so your Mazdaspeed is horribly overpriced especially for a FWD econobarge.

So by your logic, you just agreed that the same performance can be provided by much cheaper equipment, and the rest is just for show. My point exactly, as well as the thread's point.

 

[FlyPenFly]

So by your logic, you just agreed that the same performance can be provided by much cheaper equipment, and the rest is just for show. My point exactly, as well as the thread's point.

No, that it's a trivial aspect that discounts the other major features.

 

[cmantis]

Customer service can be improved a lot if they stop the group buy thing and established an US agent. No business in US wants to deal with their returns when they are still doing the group buy thing from China. That's the business model they cannot get away with. Since group buy is working for them, they don't want to rock the boat. And US vendors will not want to handle their problem unless they are guaranteed a market and get a good margin say $37 cost and $100 margin(exaggeration of course), LOL.

They actually have one now and won't sell certain products. For those companies it just takes someone stepping up to the plate and agreeing on this end to be that player. I am sure they actually prefer it, guaranteed minimums and less hassle on their end.

Back on track I think the most overpriced thing for a reef aquarium is some of the advice and opinions but these same opinions can also be the most valuable its just hard to separate sometimes especially when I was new :scratchch

 

[Moneymaks24]

Anyone selling an apex controller? Lol

 

[bhazard451]

No, that it's a trivial aspect that discounts the other major features.

Except there are none. The outside magnet is the only difference, as all of the Vortech modes are available, and provide the same or better performance if you choose to use a reef controller for the other pumps. If you're spending the money on Vortechs, you are very likely to own a reef controller too, which enables sync/anti-sync, the only other feature not included in the other pumps by default.

Heat in the tank? I run a backup wp-25 to stir saltwater and it changed the temp in the bucket 1 degree overnight. Non issue.

Don't let bias cloud your judgement. I've owned multiple MP10s and MP40s previously. Exactly what magical features aside from the outside magnet are different? None.

 

[reefs4life]

How is the outside magnet not a big feature for you? That's their whole innovation and selling point (not to mention their modes and communication abilities), no other pump on the market has an external motor like Vortech does. To each their own, but I know in my tank, the Vortechs are bothersome as is, I can't imagine having the entire pump in the tank like a WP-40 or the Koralias that I used to have. If it was for me I'd do a closed loop w/ a SWCD and than no pumps would be in the tank altogether.

Until the mighty Jebao (that you put so much faith into) comes out with a VORTECH look alike, I'm not buying this whole price vs. performance thing. To be honest, all they are is a controllable Koralia, for all the credit you give WP-40s why not bring the controllable Koralias into the discussion, it's basically the same thing. I'm sure that someone can orchestrate some sort of DIY hookup to control Koralias the same exact way.

 

[bhazard451]

How is the outside magnet not a big feature for you? That's their whole innovation and selling point (not to mention their modes and communication abilities), no other pump on the market has an external motor like Vortech does. To each their own, but I know in my tank, the Vortechs are bothersome as is, I can't imagine having the entire pump in the tank like a WP-40 or the Koralias that I used to have. If it was for me I'd do a closed loop w/ a SWCD and than no pumps would be in the tank altogether.

Until the mighty Jebao (that you put so much faith into) comes out with a VORTECH look alike, I'm not buying this whole price vs. performance thing. To be honest, all they are is a controllable Koralia, for all the credit you give WP-40s why not bring the controllable Koralias into the discussion, it's basically the same thing. I'm sure that someone can orchestrate some sort of DIY hookup to control Koralias the same exact way.

They are absolutely not the same thing. The equivalent DC Koralias require the Koralia Wavemaker to function (unless there's a hack available for apex/RA) which costs $350 to provide the wave functions. The supposed equivalent pump itself would be the Koralia 8, which is $169, but no one has actually shown its performance in comparison. It may/may not even match up to the WP40/6105. It would be stupid to not buy a Vortech at that price point instead.

The AC Koralia Evos don't provide anywhere near the same wave modes, or power. You need to jump up to the Magnums, and they are not controllable. I've owned many Koralias too, so yes, I've seen and tested all of them except for Tunze in my tanks.

Like it or not, the WP40 moves the same 3500gph, with the same wave modes as both the MP40 and the 6105. It just does it for hundreds less.

The trade off on the MP40 being outside the tank and WP40/Tunze on the inside is the dead silence running the pump at 100%, compared to an MP40 at 100% on NTM or short pulse going WHOMP WHOMP WHOMP very loudly in the living room.

 

[shookONES]

LED lighting...enough said.

 

[oh207]

LED lighting for me; in terms of a single unit cost. After much research, I learned that the #1 thing to do is have patience and get the right equipment up front.
I am expecting my Apex unit soon and I'm looking forward to getting just about every probe for it!

I'm not in this hobby to cut corners or be penny wise. Sooner or later, you get burned and end up looking for a better quality product.

 

[FlyPenFly]

I'm not in this hobby to cut corners or be penny wise. Sooner or later, you get burned and end up looking for a better quality product.

That's certainly the biggest lesson I learned.