My Fish Are Dead - Ideas Why?

[ellebelle]

Four days ago, my tank was stocked with 3 chromis, 1 tomato clownfish and 1 Pyle's wrasse. On Wednesday, Brett noticed that my clown seemed to have ich, and maybe one of the chromis had it, but the other fish seemed fine. Nevertheless, I decided to net them all out and put them in my quarantine tank. It was a huge pain to get them out, but eventually (with Eric's assistance) we got all 5 fish out and into a quarantine tank. We were keeping the clown in a smaller tank inside the 10g for a few days until the other fish got more comfortable in the tank. I used 6 or 7 gallons of water from my main tank to start the QT. The fish seemed okay - I fed them and all five ate fine. I dropped some SeaCure into the water, tested the levels of copper using a test kit, and all looked fine.

The next day, I added a couple of cups of fresh RO/DI water and a bunch more salt water that I made. I also used some of the new saltwater to finish topping off my main tank (I need a bigger bucket for mixing salt). I fed the fish in the morning, and all of them ate. In the afternoon, I noticed that the temperature had gotten a little high and the fish weren't looking so hot, so I turned down the heater and watched them for a while. Temperature went down, and the fish seemed more energetic. I'd been keeping the QT at 84 degrees anyway to speed up the lifecycle of the ich. I think the highest it got to was 88-89 degrees. I put a tiny bit of food in the tank to see if they would still eat, and though they were a bit lethargic, all five fish again ate.

Before I went out on Sunday night, they were all swimming around. Temperature was a solid 83 degrees and I thought everything was fine. When I got home six hours later, four out of five fish were dead. The largest chromis was still alive, but he was hovering in one place at the top of the water. I tried to feed him, but he ignored the food. I figured if I left him in the QT tank, he wouldn't have long to live, so I tossed him back into my display tank and hoped I wasn't making a huge mistake. Woke up this morning, and he's fine - swimming around and eating, though he looks a little lost. My display tank in general is 100% fine - all corals open and growing, Ammonia/Nitrite/Nitrate levels at zero.

So, here are my questions:

1: What killed my fish? Bad batch of SeaCure? Or did I do something wrong?

2: I'm sure my main tank has ich in it, and now it has a new host. I'm loathe to quarantine again until I figure out what went wrong the first time. Idea of what I can do in the meantime?

3: I know that chromis are schooling fish. Is my one surviving fish goiing to be okay on his own? I don't really want to invest anymore money in livestock until I know I've gotten rid of all of the ich in my tank.

4: What should I do with the powerhead in my QT tank? It used to be in my main tank, and my flow is suffering without it. But, on the other hand, I know you should really have all things separate for a QT. Should I just buy a new powerhead for my main tank?

Sorry for the length on this, and thanks to anyone who manages to read through it. I'm especially sad about the loss of my fairy wrasse. and I know that is one fish I won't be able to replace (unless I suddently win the lottery or something). I am planning to test the levels in the QT water soon and will update.

 

[prattreef]

Wow sorry to hear about this... especially the pylei. Sounds like between the ich, the stress of capture, the copper and the high temp. stress they couldn't handle it. (Aren't clownfish very susceptible to copper?? )IME fish that get a touch of ich in a reef display are best left there to fight it off by themselves aided by nutritional supplementation, the more stable environment and the increased presence of parasite predators. Removing all your fish is a pretty extreme measure.

Your chromis will be fine on its own, but at this point, I might sacrifice him to the QT tank and let your main system stand fishless for a few weeks and truly rid it of ick. I'd also get a new powerhead.

Randy

 

[Deanos]

1: What killed my fish?

Probably a combination of these:

It was a huge pain to get them out, but eventually (with Eric's assistance) we got all 5 fish out and into a quarantine tank. We were keeping the clown in a smaller tank inside the 10g for a few days until the other fish got more comforta

Stress

On Wednesday, Brett noticed that my clown seemed to have ich

Ich

I noticed that the temperature had gotten a little high and the fish weren't looking so hot

Elevated water temperature

I added a couple of cups of fresh RO/DI water and a bunch more salt water that I made.

Salinity swing

 

[digitalreefer]

Randy, it doesn't seem to be stress related, as they were all swimming and eating in the QT tank. They really did seem fine, then all of them died within 2 hours of one another.

 

[prattreef]

Then I'd suspect low O2 levels for what ever reason. RD

 

[ellebelle]

Salinity is exactly the same as my display tank. The RO/DI water I added with the salt would have only been enough to replace evap.

 

[scarf_ace1981]

Wow sorry to hear about this... especially the pylei. Sounds like between the ich, the stress of capture, the copper and the high temp. stress they couldn't handle it

Randy

ditto. i've tried to qt fish by removing them from the dispaly and they usually die. from now on qt all your fish before adding them into the display.

 

[ellebelle]

Anyone have any advice on what I should do with my main tank now? My last surviving chomis is hanging out by the glass, staring at his reflection. But I don't want to put more fish in a tank that I know has ich.

 

[mgchan]

I agree with prattreef, low O2. If you had a powerhead in the tank, you needed to point that towards the surface of the water or used a hang-on power filter or even the ol' air stone.

 

[fritz]

Wait did you say that you added salt directly to the QT tank with fish in it?

That is FAR more harmful than you are giving credit for. NEVER mix salt in water that has fish in it. You could move the chromis to the QT tank but a few words of wisdom here:

1. If your QT tank is newly setup it will undergo a cycle just like your main system. Keep those test kits handy and be ready to do many water changes if necessary. You don't want to add poison to an illness.

2. Your display tank cannot have fish for at least 45 days. Inverts and corals are ok but no fish. Keep the temp high, around 82 degrees. This will speed up the metabolism of the ich and it will hopefully starve to death quicker.

 

[prattreef]

Why are you adding salt to make up for evaporation? The salt doesn't evaporate. Top off should be RO/DI only.

Did the fish have any other signs of bloody spots on the fins or other symptoms? I ask because there was a rash of such a disease a few months back the presented originally as a few spots of ick and proceeded exceedingly rapidly to death. It wiped out many advanced reefer tanks without clear explanation Warren's being one of them. RD

 

[ellebelle]

No, I didn't add salt directly to the tank.

I added plain RO/DI to replace the evap. Then I topped the tank off with pre-mixed salt water of exactly the same salinity to increase water volume. The saltwater had been mixing for a full 24 hours and I checked the salinity in both the bucket and the tank with the same hydrometer.

It's funny you mention the bloody spots. I didn't notice anything particularly when the fish were alive, but I did notice that they seemd to all have bloody spots around the gill and flank area when they died. I thought it looked odd - different than when I've seen other dead fish in tanks, but I didn't really think much of it. I also didn't think to look for any other symptoms once I saw the white spots.

 

[prattreef]

I thought you knew better RD

 

[ellebelle]

You replied too quickly! Just edited previous post to answer bloody fins question.

 

[prattreef]

Well, we may have a winner. I'd ask warren and Pierce about it as they have seen this personally. RD

 

[cali_reef]

Could be any number of things but I think stress may be the key.

 

[Chiefmcfuz]

Lissa,

Sorry for your loss.

Stress is my main thought too, the catch and transfer and the stress caused by the temp swing, and even stress caused by the ich. O2 levels may have something to do with the bloody spots on the gills. Were they gasping for air at all before they died?

I would let the chromis alone for a little while and see if he does develop ich. You may be dooming him either way, He should be ok alone. I would also say that if he does catch ich I would let it run it's course and see what happens, however if he passes I would let your tank be fish free for 2 or 3 months so you can be sure all the ich eggs have hatched and died off cause they have nothing to host on.

Good luck.

 

[tosiek]

did you check the ammonia/trite levels when they died? Sounds a little like your QT had a cycle, 4 fish in a 10g just set up is alot of bioload for a newly set up tank.

The bloody or red/inflamed gills i was told are signs of high nitrates, or what randy said. Think its brought on by low O2 and high trites. My sis overfed my cichlid tank while i was away for a week and it sounds like the same thing happened, cept lost only 1 fish. Had the same signs with the red/blood gills, fish gasping for air. Dropped in some bio-spira and they wre fine after 6 hours, 2 fish still have the red gills.

 

[ellebelle]

I tested the Ammonia/Nitrite and Nitrate levels, and they are all zero. Copper was .10, which is actually a little low for treatment. My display tank fluccuates between 78 and 82 degrees in a day, so the overall temp in the tank wasn't a lot higher than the main tank, and it was brought up slowly over the course of several hours.

 

[digitalreefer]

I don't buy the stress being the killer only because 5 fish were swimming around in the QT happy and healthy when we went out, and a few hours later 4 were dead and one didn't look good. We put the one back in the main tank and he's happy and healthy looking now. There couldn't have been a cycle, as the levels all read 0 and we used water from the main tank for the QT.