Flow Question Please Help ?

[chuck116]

Hello I got my new pan world 200 pump and asm g4plus skimmer installed and running tonight on my 180 rr perfecto tank. My problem is that the pump runs the sump dry if I dont close the ball valve part way. Previous to this setup I had a mag 12 in sump pump and a current skimmer, and although its a lot less flow I had no problems with flow or return. I wanted to up my flow to start keeping corals. My question is , is my sump to small ? its a proclear 4 its 36 x 15 x 15. Its currently set up so the flow is comming in , the next compartment is my skimmer I wanted to keep the fuge so I installed a partition next its only six inches hi by 15 inches wide and the next partition has a one inch bulkhead drilled in it for the pump feed. I need help or suggestions please. the tank is factory drilled. THANKS FOR READING ...

Chuck P

 

[mray]

It's normal for the water level in the sump to decrease due to the use of a larger pump. You will notice that water line in your display has gone up. What you can do is add more saltwater into your sump but be warned, your sump might over flow when you cut the power if you sump is too small.

 

[House of Laughter]

Chuck - panworld 200? that's an external correct? if so, it's a whole hell of allot stronger than the mag 12. With pressure rated pumps - especially external ones, the head loss is allot less than that of the internal mag drives. if you were getting 900-1000gph from the mag12 I'd be surprised - rest assured you're getting the full compliment on that panworld - that pump kicks some @$$

House

 

[chuck116]

the pump does kick ass but i cant set it full bore. I think my sump is too small but cant see spending 5 to 6 hundred on a new one. really need so help / suggestions. I really want to be able to get the full use from this pimp and skimmer and also want to rn a refugium . PLEASE HELP !!!!

 

[House of Laughter]

chuck - a pump that strong can easily handle a manifold off ti run additional equipment - I would run reactors and maybe even a chiller off it to settle it down and even then open it up all the way - if you keep it dialed down for too long (months) it could burn the pump out -

House

 

[chuck116]

I want to open it up . im not experienced enough to really know what you mean ALTHOUGH I am a mechanic so i know what a maniflod is. I honestly planed ON GETTING SOME TWO LITTLE FISHES OR STUFF LIKE THAT BUT WANT TO HAVE IT RUNNING PROPERLY FIRST. SORRY FOR CAPS

 

[NYPDFrogman]

what size return do you have?
need at least one 1.5" return

I ran an Iwaki RLT40 on my 180 with a 1.5" durso and single corner box.

having more flow from your DT through sump isnt really benificial for corals
better off with Internal circulation IE power heads closed loop

 

[chuck116]

its the factory return there are 2 , I believe they are 1 1/2 i guess to be sure i would have to check with pefecto

 

[KathyC]

Chuck...is the 180 already set up or can you possibly change the size of the sump to something larger?
Jim has a great idea there with the use of a manifold to run other equipment off the same pump.

Some say it is better not to have a fast flow through the sump (in the fuge area)..and some say it works just as well to have more of the 'flow' controlled in the DT by powerheads or Vortech like devices rather than by a huge amount of water running through the returns..but either way you need to be concerned that your sump will accomodate all of the water that will drain back to it in the even of a power failure.

 

[NYPDFrogman]

its the factory return there are 2 , I believe they are 1 1/2 i guess to be sure i would have to check with pefecto

sorry I meant drains

you need to get the water back to the sump from DT as quickly as your pumping it from sump to DT

 

[chuck116]

I can change the sump and will if thats the best thing. I am thinking my sump is too small . I have 4 additional koralia 4 s that I can run in the display for flow. I will look into the manifold system .. sorry itype so slow. DOES ANYONE KNOW IF I CAN RUN THE ASM G4 off that pump also ?

 

[KathyC]

I believe that NYPDFrogman has his ASM skimmer hooked up like that in some way. Hopefully he will chime back in here shortly.
wait..I almost take that back...didn't you get a pump with the ASM skimmer? (it requires a special kind of pump) I think he has his skimmer fed from his return...

 

[NYPDFrogman]

I can change the sump and will if thats the best thing. I am thinking my sump is too small . I have 4 additional koralia 4 s that I can run in the display for flow. I will look into the manifold system .. sorry itype so slow. DOES ANYONE KNOW IF I CAN RUN THE ASM G4 off that pump also ?

I dont think changing your sump will solve your problem it sounds like your delivering water from your sump quicker than you can drain from the tank.
if you mod your ASM to recirculate you CAN feed it from manfold.I may be wrong in this thinking but I se that as kind of backwards. I prefer to skim the water before it returns to tank not using a portion of return water to feed skimmer( does that make sense??)

I see a couple of options increase the drain size by adding another drain pipe
re size the pump in proportion to your existing drain ( IE 1" drain with a linear overflow of 9" will handle 700GPH- 800GPH)

Yes, you can. I believe that NYPDFrogman has his ASM skimmer hooked up like that. Hopefully he will chime back in here shortly.

my G4+ is heavily mod'ed it is fed by the stock sedra 9000( with venturi and needle wheel) and I have a sedra 5000 doing a recirculation also with venturi and needle wheel.

 

[chuck116]

by the calculation link from frank it said 14.16 loss of head pressure or 6.12 psi flow rate 1171 gph

 

[chuck116]

im very sorry this is all new to me and hard to understand.

 

[chuck116]

could i drain the tank and redrill the returns and feeds bigger ???? or is that a stupid idea ???

 

[NYPDFrogman]

could i drain the tank and redrill the returns and feeds bigger ???? or is that a stupid idea ???

not at all (a stupid idea:splitspin ) if you dont have any livestock that will work
will your overflow box accommodate a 1.25 or 1.5 inch drain pipe?
is there room to construct a durso ( quiet drain)?

I think the drains are more of a concern rather than the pump returns

 

[chuck116]

I would be willing to setup another tank that i have . i only have six fish in there at this time. i wish i knew what a durso drain was. i think there is room to open up the existing holes in the tank. i can house the 200 lbs of rock in a rubber maid container in the mean time. will check to see if it is able to be redrilled and consider a smaller pump.

 

[NYPDFrogman]

I would be willing to setup another tank that i have . i only have six fish in there at this time. i wish i knew what a durso drain was. i think there is room to open up the existing holes in the tank. i can house the 200 lbs of rock in a rubber maid container in the mean time. will check to see if it is able to be redrilled and consider a smaller pump.

might be easier to get a smaller pump sized for the drains and set up Tunzes or vortechs for circulation
you can turn them off when feeding and there are many different ways you can position them to suit your needs

DURSO
http://www.rl180reef.com/180/pages/standpipe/

 

[chuck116]

ok frank thanks, and thanks for the link.