Agents of Reform at IMAC-Chicago

[Anonymous]

Quote:
Gresham followed up w/ the quiery to Les Village which was the place where a few thousand could make the most immediate impact. That was where I wanted the contribution to go.
Les didn't respond which surprised me and its a shame.


It would have been nice if we had been told that. Instead, we heard about it via the rumor mill.

Rich, I did inform the BOD thru verbal comminucation (and maybe the BOD forum) that I was having trouble getting ahold of Ruwi. Is this the rumor mill your talking about?

To be fair, Steve was a componant of the plan, as was I. If there's blame to be placed on that, IMO I have a share of it.

Fair enough.
The rumor mill was mostly through different people and conversations at ASAP, and you of course.
I know you were an initial part of the discussions about LES, but to all appearances Steve took it over.

 

[bookfish]

Jim,
I sure don't remember you guys being so eager to contribute at all.
If you were....why not still be then?
At one single meeting over a year agowe discussed this and never again.
You took off for Tonga, there were BOD elections and I thought BAR was far more passionate about frag swaps then serious reform.

Gresham followed up w/ the quiery to Les Village which was the place where a few thousand could make the most immediate impact. That was where I wanted the contribution to go.
Les didn't respond which surprised me and its a shame.
I do know that they have gone thru a lot of turmoil this past year and you guys should take that into account.
Ruwi stepped down as Les director and his second doesn't communicate well or often. Since you wrote them off [ and me as well] from a single effort one might question your commitment as well.

You guys may have let me in on the need to contribute a little more clearly and especially after Les didn't answer.
I have talked to you all since and you don't ever bring it up.I thought it was you who didn't care that much and I never pressured you again.
Now you suddenly front-load it again?....fine.
Do you still want to help somewhere?
On what scale?
Since you are not into the training thing that I do, you need to develop more of your own ways to contribute and not blame my agenda for the lack of your own.
You guys could also lead and generate initiatives as well. Why don't you?
What have you done since our non-connection?

Many of your surprising [ to me] concerns could easily be handled in pms or in person as we're all here in the Bay area....and your messages could reflect more the civil manner that you ask the rest of us to take.
Setting a better example would be a good idea.

Steve

I won't reply to each point as Thales did, since he pretty well covered what I think and remember.
I certainly didn't mean to be uncivil. I think I am somewhat frustrated when I see the potential to (hopefully) do something positive wasted.
I believe the good work you have done and your recounting of it has created an expectation of something more. This is particuliarly true if you want to talk about others' failings.
And yes, I want to help, as others do, as I'm sure other clubs do, but I'm very skeptical about self reform of a private industry built on an exploitationist model in the first place. I think if change is going to occur in this industry it will either be through an NPO, enforced legislation or simple market forces at work (reduction of availability of livestock). -Jim

 

[clarionreef]

The director [and my friend Ruwi] of les village didn't respond which surpised me and its a shame.


Gresham followed up w/ the quiery to Les Village which was the place where a few thousand could make the most immediate impact. That was where I wanted the contribution to go.
Les didn't respond which surprised me and its a shame.


I mean, ya go to bat for the guy and he doesn't co-operate. I am still not sure why. It just made no sense.

One could over-think and over-analyze things to death I suppose but Ruwi has been oddly silent for some time now and it makes it difficult to garner support for the villages past fine efforts.
Of course it hurt me more then most and getting blamed for it is unfair.
Thats what I get for trying to help I guess.
Gresham of the BAR club also tried to help and wrote the project up and sent the correspondance.
Since he was in the club...the disappointment was no secret.
And thats the last time we try to get him a date with anyone, especially the BAR club as they apparently don't like being stood up.

And thats what happened.

Steve

 

[Anonymous]

The director [and my friend Ruwi] of les village didn't respond which surpised me and its a shame.


Gresham followed up w/ the quiery to Les Village which was the place where a few thousand could make the most immediate impact. That was where I wanted the contribution to go.
Les didn't respond which surprised me and its a shame.


I mean, ya go to bat for the guy and he doesn't co-operate. I am still not sure why. It just made no sense.

One could over-think and over-analyze things to death I suppose but Ruwi has been oddly silent for some time now and it makes it difficult to garner support for the villages past fine efforts.
Of course it hurt me more then most and getting blamed for it is unfair.
Thats what I get for trying to help I guess.
Gresham of the BAR club also tried to help and wrote the project up and sent the correspondance.
Since he was in the club...the disappointment was no secret.
And thats the last time we try to get him a date with anyone, especially the BAR club as they apparently don't like being stood up.

And thats what happened.

Steve

Steve,

No one is blaming you for Les not following through, so stop playing the martyr.

 

[clarionreef]

??????????
Rich just wrote;
No one is blaming you for Les not following through, so stop playing the martyr.
But just yesterday...

And to be fair, that's really your fault. You asked to come to a BOD meeting after posting on the club forum* and to tell the club about Les and how much money you were looking for and what that money was to be used for.

And thats why I do not understand your English. :lol:
Steve

 

[Anonymous]

??????????
Rich just wrote;
No one is blaming you for Les not following through, so stop playing the martyr.
But just yesterday...

And to be fair, that's really your fault. You asked to come to a BOD meeting after posting on the club forum* and to tell the club about Les and how much money you were looking for and what that money was to be used for.

And thats why I do not understand your English. :lol:
Steve

I don't see where in any of that Les not following through is somehow being put on your shoulders.

This is what the above was in response to:

I sure don't remember you guys being so eager to contribute at all.
If you were....why not still be then?
At one single meeting over a year ago we discussed this and never again.

We were eager to contribute.
We are still willing to contribute
At the end of the meeting you were asked to give us something in writing and you never did.
You asked to come talk about Les and you didn't talk about Les.

The things you did or didn't do are your fault. Les not responding isn't. Just because I used the word fault doesn't mean that everything is your fault.