The Smoking Gun?

[mkirda]

Near as I can figure things out, this is what Jaime considers the smoking gun. From an e-mail dated April 9th, 2003...

Marivi at one time was highly critical of the MAC. She was going to resign, but somehow MAC persuaded her not to.

After resigning from MAC, Ferdie disassociated himself from them. This includes the MAC certified exporters for the most part. Instead of having the backing of Marivi, Ferdie needed to find other exporters interested in net-caught fish.

He began to work with Imperial, RVS and others and some new collection areas. He needed to be sure that he would have some place to sell the fish besides the MAC certified exporters. Somewhat surprisingly, they not only wanted the fish, but they gave him some funds for locally available netting.

Ferdie got the local governments to open MO collection again, got collectors trained, and started shipping their fish on a trial basis.

Ferdie sends out an e-mail informing a few people about these developments. A couple of people talk and one makes an off-hand comment that he thinks Ferdie might be getting some money from Imperial. This gets written as Person X thinks ...

To which Ferdie replies that people can think what they want, but that the truth is that he has gotten no salary. That they are bridges for moving net-caught fish. And that he doesn't want to work for them because now he is free and unconstrained. The exporters cannot tell him what to do.

Ferdie goes on to talk about his dream- Forming an alternate exporters association. He wants Imperial to succeed, because if they do succeed, those sitting on the fence waiting to see if he will be successful will join them. He thinks that they can be a viable alternative to the MAC.
He also speaks about how the thing that makes him happiest is being out in the field, fighting for the collectors and training them to do things right.

Ferdie's sin? He is hard-headed and didn't want to run to Marivi and beg her for help. Instead he forged his own path.

That's it in a nutshell. The whole gun, smoke and all.
This is what Jaime has been feeding everyone bits and pieces of, all out of context.

So much is different now.

Regards.
Mike Kirda

 

[mkirda]

Fishermen cutting hand netting from a bundle I donated.

Horrific stuff, isn't it?

 

[Anonymous]

Notice how he's treating the netting, making precise cuts. Nice photo Mike.

 

[dizzy]

Notice how he's treating the netting, making precise cuts. Nice photo Mike.

Notice how it takes three people. Must be union job.

 

[Anonymous]

Pro basketball jerseys are like $65 each over here! Man, those guys must make boatloads of cash! (Yes, pun intended.)



Peace,

Chip

 

[MaryHM]

After reading the full email you sent me yesterday, Mike, all I can say is that if this is the email Jaime is talking about he is taking it totally out of context. Of course, he still hasn't forwarded me the email- maybe because he's afraid that if we're all sure we're talking about the same thing he will end up looking like a fool as his ridiculous conspiracy theory is ripped apart by the facts. If we are all talking about the email you sent me, it kind of reminds me of how people read the Bible. They'll pull out one little verse- completely out of context- and form an entire religion about it. Been dancing with any rattlesnakes lately, Jaime??

 

[mkirda]

Notice how he's treating the netting, making precise cuts. Nice photo Mike.

Thanks go out to Ferdie- His photo, his credit. I just resized and sharpened it a little...

Oh, and to put it into context, this was after a meeting with fishermen. I'm sure there were more guys standing around, they just aren't in the frame.

As far as the jersey... If you think that was $65, you got another thing coming... Let's just say that I doubt it was more than US$7, and probably less than that. Unless it was a present from a US relative... :wink:

Regards.
Mike Kirda

 

[clarionreef]

Guys,
Fila has a major factory in Manila and they crank out atheletic apparel in amazing quantity. This stuff is very inexpensive by our standards in the 'Fila-pines.' Steve

 

[horge]

Uhmmm.

1. The Jersey
I can get a jersey juuuust like that, with matching shorts in any palengke (open market) garment section. In Divisoria, the set (with towel wristbands) goes for around P 375.oo prior to haggling. That's US$6.95 to the uninitiated.

If you can buy overruns at the 'factory', it's less than half that.
The material is top notch, though the seams can be weak.

Original NBA apparel is available in Manila malls at over 30% markup fronm US prices. Autographed Iverson jerseys seem to be the hot thing, three years running. He was quite charming when he and his mom visited to promote the apparel/shoe brand he favors some time back, but I digress...


2. The Netcutting Union
As for taking three dudes to cut up the net...
Mirones, no?
When I cook, or even when I just prepare game, the number of people hanging around, trying to 'help', can be pretty aggravating.




3. Conspiracy Theories
Maybe I can interest the obsessed in some Templar-Merovingian-Magdalenian bloodline crap. Oh wait, there's no Carolingian Nazi Third Reich for that kind of fabrication to be used against...


Jaime,
If you receive private communications that raise your doubts about a third person, then you can certainly attempt to verify such hearsay using the same PRIVATE channels that raised your doubts in the first place.

If you start questioning a person's honesty and ethics in public, under the aegis of seeking information, then you are either a well-meaning oaf for failing to realize the harm done to a potentialy-innocent person's reputation, ...or you are out to do a hatchet job, but como un maricon; sin cojones:

Make an accusation clearly, like a man, and don't hide behind some 'wondering aloud', half-cocked innuendo BS. You'd better have, hold and present hard evidence (not just hearsay) to back your publicly-voiced doubt of someone's honesty, or else keep it private.

You of all people should be above this.


horge

 

[Anonymous]

Uhhh...guys? I was kidding about the jersey...



Peace,

Chip

 

[horge]

Have a nice day, Chip.

I thought we were being as light-hearted as well...
about the jerseys. Here's a winkie for you.
:wink:

Heck, why not another?
:wink:




My comments on conspiracy theories (and theorists) were dead serious.

 

[Anonymous]

Have a nice day, Chip.
I thought we were being as light-hearted as well...
about the jerseys. Here's a winkie for you.
:wink:
Heck, why not another?
:wink:

Sorry, my brain is not functioning today...I missed the light-heartedness.

My comments on conspiracy theories (and theorists) were dead serious.

That's not surprising. The main thing I get from this forum is the fact that not everyone is telling the whole story simply because there's either exposing facts that would be revealed or damning evidence against someone. Nothing adds up.

Peace,

Chip

 

[Anonymous]

Damn shame no one wants to post the supposed 'smoking gun' memo so we can make up our own minds about it. About half of you seem to already have it and at least two people here have been giving us paraphase sections from it. One of those people asserts that there are conflict of interest issues and the other asserts there are not conflict of interest issues.

Seems that most of you green people have closets full of skelitons, lots of secret email discussions and excellent verbal skills at running people down.

Ta ta

 

[mkirda]

Damn shame no one wants to post the supposed 'smoking gun' memo so we can make up our own minds about it. About half of you seem to already have it and at least two people here have been giving us paraphase sections from it. One of those people asserts that there are conflict of interest issues and the other asserts there are not conflict of interest issues.

Sardonic,

According to Jaime, the e-mail in question was not addressed to him- someone forwarded it to him back in April. Yet here it is the later half of August and suddenly it is offered up as BIG NEWS?
That in and of itself is fishy.

I have asked Jaime for clarification on the actual e-mail. Mary has asked him for clarification on the actual e-mail. Two or three times. So far, Jaime has not responded.

If I could be sure that the e-mail Jaime was forwarded and the e-mail I think it is are the same, I could ask the author permission to post it.
But I refuse to post anything private here without explicit information from the author.

As I see it, you should be bugging Jaime to answer my/our question(s).

Seems that most of you green people have closets full of skelitons, lots of secret email discussions and excellent verbal skills at running people down.Ta ta

I have no skeletons. I have lots of e-mail discussions with a variety of people. I assume you do as well. I consider all of those discussions you have with all of your friends, family, co-workers, etc. private and confidential. I do not consider them to be secret- I just consider them to be none of my business.

Can you explain to me why a private e-mail apparently addressed to me should be open to everyone's prying eyes? I'm just curious how my understand of e-mail differs from yours.

And if you were addressing me with the 'running people down' comment, all I can say is that I am truly sorry you feel this way. I try very, very hard to play fair when arguing points. I have no problem with tearing apart someone's logic, but I do have a problem with tearing someone apart. The argument is about ideas, not personalities, and every time anyone makes it personal or attacks personalities, I believe it makes this forum a lot less than it could be. It may make for cheap entertainment, but it also cheapens this forum.

Regards.
Mike Kirda

 

[MaryHM]

Jaime is the one that started the accusations. Jaime is the one who refuses to forward the "offending" email to me- even though I've asked him several times and he says that it was originally addressed to me, thereby creating no conflict of privacy. I have to wonder why Jaime doesn't want us to know what email he is talking about. Doesn't that make you curious as well, Sardonic? That someone would level a serious, serious accusation against someone based on an email that he refuses to forward to people who were the original intended participants so a true discussion can be had? If the guy would deal with this in a professional manner, he wouldn't open himself up to criticism. If I ever get the email, I plan on asking Ferdinand if I can print it here. I have never read anything from Ferdinand that leads me to believe he is in the industry or trying to make money off of reform. So I would have no qualms about posting it here with his permission.

 

[MaryHM]

Seems that most of you green people have closets full of skelitons, lots of secret email discussions and excellent verbal skills at running people down

If you are referring to me with this comment, I would appreciate you spelling out my skeletons- not making some vague reference that may or may not include me. My reputation is extremely important to me. I challenge you to please find and publicly post the skeleton(s) in my closet. I think this is what Rover is getting tired of. Open, vague accusations based on either nothing or nothing that the author is willing to reveal. Do I have "secret" email discussions? I have email discussions. Especially where Ferdinand is concerned, this forum is an impossible way to communicate with him. Sometimes it takes up to 2 weeks to get an email answered because he is in the field constantly. I didn't realize that email discussions between similarly goal-minded people were somehow suspect.

 

[clarionreef]

Gee wilikers,
I stopped importing from Imperial in May because Ferdie DID NOT get involved!
I wanted him to be there, help screen the fish, take more of an active interest and insure I finally got some blue tangs.
Alas, it was not to be.
When you train and convert divers, following up with them and helping them to market and get a better deal for their produce is an obligation I think. In my view back then, he did not do this enough! HE WAS ALWAYS SO BUSY IN THE FIELD.
The MAC country co-ordinator however, does this every day! Since he's not really a field guy, he's in Manila all the time.
Whenever the president of the exporters association wants fish [weekly] she text messages him and he insures she gets em. In fact she gets priority first pick all the time.
By Jaimes reasoning, MAC is in bed with the head of the association who just happens to be on the board of MAC! As I just described, the secretary of the association also orders the fishes. That one is also a MAC exporter. If there is a problem, the MAC country co-ordinator is 'on it'? Hes in sinc. in cahoots and on the job of insuring the MAC exporters get fish from the divers trained. His job is pretty easy though because the magical MAC fish are so few, in both number and in quantity.
I have always known this but until Jaimes 'tattle tale. epic posting, thought it business as usual. Now given this information, ARE WE TO BE TREATED TO SMOKING GUN # 2?
Not from me. Sic em OVA...I mean OVI...
Sincerely, Steve
P.S. Oh I forgot...your sense of right and wrong is strictly team oriented...not ethically based. You would never follow up on this.

 

[clarionreef]

Gee wilikers,
I stopped importing from Imperial in May because Ferdie DID NOT get involved!
I wanted him to be there, help screen the fish, take more of an active interest and insure I finally got some blue tangs.
Alas, it was not to be.
When you train and convert divers, following up with them and helping them to market and get a better deal for their produce is an obligation I think. In my view back then, he did not do this enough!
The MAC country co-ordinator however, does this every day!
Whenever the president of the exporters association wants fish [weekly] she text messages him and he insures she gets em. In fact she gets priority first pick all the time.
By Jaimes reasoning, MAC is in bed with the head of the association who just happens to be on the board of MAC! As I just described, the secretary of the association also orders the fishes. That one is also a MAC exporter. If there is a problem, the MAC country co-ordinator is 'on it'? Hes in sinc. in cahoots and on the job of insuring the MAC exporters get fish from the divers trained. His job is pretty easy though because the magical MAC fish are so few, in both number and in quantity.
I have always known this but until Jaimes 'tattle tale. epic posting, thought it business as usual. Now given this information, ARE WE TO BE TREATED TO SMOKING GUN # 2?
Not from me. Sic em OVA...I mean OVI...
Sincerely, Steve
Oh I forgot...your sense of right and wrong is strictly team oriented...not ethically based. You would never follow up on this.

 

[Douglas S Lehman]

Hello Steve
Is that smoking gun a (Calibre 357)

 

[clarionreef]

There is no smoking gun.
Only fraudulent, bogus charges like the fake trainings of the Haribon Foundation.
Smoke, mirrors and fraud.
Now you have had a look at their chief representative and his m.o.
Is it not becoming clearer now why the trainings we have heard so much about bore so little fruit?
This is really the issue. Not the messenger boy.
Steve