BLUE TANG WARS

[clarionreef]

People,
Dealers who bring in fish from the Philippines were given the notice last week that the price of blue tangs, [ yep, the hippo tang ] will go up 30% or so.
This is on account of their increasing scarcity thru destruction of critical habitat...ie. large, mature acro and pocillopora coral heads. Collecting blue tangs has brought tens and thousands of squirts of sodium cyanide to the corals they live in. Over the years the damage has added up to the point that the species has vanished whereever the trade goes.
The scarcity has caused a price war of sorts to get the divers to bring them in and the increased price is passed on to the importers.
The higher premium will accelerate the search and capture of whatever is left...anywhere it can be found. Although understood and predicted for decades, this syndrome....this end game is now more official as importers across the world have it in the form of special bulletins from their favorite exporters.
The pressure on the normally cyanide caught fish was bad enough. Who knows how much extra demand was accelerated thru the Dory/ Nemo phenomena.
The disappearance of the vital, large stands of 'blue tang' coral bode ill for the future of the trade.
Alas, if only the divers were really trained when there was a chance to avoid this.
Now we get to pay the price for not doing it.
Steve
PS. The sky is not falling...but the reefs are in fact failing.

 

[Fish_dave]

Steve,

There are places in the world where blue tangs are still available in numbers and have been collected steadily for years and years. Being associated with the Solomons I know for a fact that the first reefs that we collected for blue tangs are still being collected at present with no decline in numbers collected. This has been over 10 years now. The guys in the Solomons have no cyanide to use but they are still pretty destructive in how they collect blue tangs yet it has been sustainable at least for the past 10 years with no noticable decline in numbers collected. Blue tangs are also available from Tarawa with the only restriction being the available freight space from there.

I do not order much from Bali or Manila but Blue tangs have been on the stock lists that I receive from these locations for the past several weeks. In fact I did get a few in from Manila this week that came in very nice and seem to be healthy. I have not heard of any price increase from Manila but it could be that it is yet to come to me, or maybe my supplier is just not passing it on to me. Our blue tang prices from the Solomons has stayed stable but I guess if the rest of the world raises prices we may as well follow suit. It seems that the trade is willing to pay almost any price for the Dory fish.

Dave

 

[dizzy]

Fish_Dave must=DP. There is also a company on 135st that claims to have 100% net caught blue tangs from Sri Lanka. They have medium blue hippos on super special this week.
Mitch

 

[clarionreef]

Make sure they're yellow belly blue tangs Mitch.
Sri Lanka doesn't make the other phase.
Beyond the traditional grounds the species exists of course. Remote areas in the South Pacific often abound with blue tangs. Anywhere we have not been and poisoned and busted up the coral.
Tonga used to have em on the main island...but now the corals have been hammered and crow barred so much that they are rare. Futher and futher afield, ie Ha'apai and Va'vau still have em.
The point was missed. This is not good news people. It means that where ever the trade goes...they tend to disappear!
Manila doesn't raise prices to make money. They raise em because they have had to. They make money by lowering prices!
Steve

 

[JT]

As a sales rep. at a major LA wholesaler, I am probably shooting myself in the foot in saying this. However, I strongly believe that the industry needs to take a break from Hepatus importation for a couple years. The few that have actually been coming in, both Indo and African varieties, have, IMO, not been the best in quality lately (witnessed not just at the facility I work for, but others in LA as well). It is obvious that their abundance in the wild has gone down and more agressive fishing for them is taking place.

I am coming real close to not filling them on my customers orders.

But, what the f**k do I know?

 

[clarionreef]

Well,
In the 80's the blue tang supply was a 5 hour bus ride to Manila.
I was on the bus dozens of times. They are wiped out now on Luzon...ie gone.
Its all Muslim areas now in S.E.Asia and some South Pacific ones long boat trip destinations.
Obviously the fish is in serious trouble and is not sustainable as currently 'harvested'...
But what the #%@ do I know...
That was funny JT.
Steve

 

[Anonymous]

i seem to recall someone saying that net caught fisherman were actually able to catch fish more easily and quickly than juicers

i wonder how much more quickly the tangs, or other species, would have been/be decimated by using nets, given the easier/faster collection, and cheaper prices

of course, it's only the coral death we care about, right?

if the corals aren't damaged, but the fish are removed faster than they can replace themselves, i guess it's ok ?

i think steve presents one of the best cases for aquaculture sale ONLY of ALL mo species

it's something the natives could do for a fairly good living, too

 

[clarionreef]

Well,
As nets don't kill the eggs, larvae, fry, coral and thousands of other collateral organisms, how can you know the difference?
Using Nets, by definition assumes net collecting without hammering and busting up the coral. Thats not net collecting. Thats slash and burn reef mining.
One can only imagine that if yellow tangs they were collected with cyanide and crowbars how the yellow tang resource would fare these days.
I already know that it would be a fraction of todays population...

Reef recruitment studies with and without coral destruction has already been undertaken by Jones and Syms on the Great Barrier Reef.
They busted up whole reef patches...busted up half of some and left the rest alone. Then as the quintessential reefnerds they are...they monitored recovery for two years!
Guess what they found?
hint;
To anyone half awake at 4:00am the answer is extremely obvious....
Its a huge...duh...
The results now rest on shelves in labs and in files ...for dust mites to see.
Steve

OK,
Some need a hint ;
There is a 'bit of a difference' in habitat destruction recovery and non habitat destruction recovery rates for fish recruitment.
Anything that destroys coral habitat is treason to the trade.
Reefers should relize this.

 

[Anonymous]

I am coming real close to not filling them on my customers orders.

...are you sure you haven't started already? I ordered two of them this week and got none.



Peace,

Chip

 

[JT]

Chip:

Just say no to blue tang.

I did it for your own good. The Tang Police already have a warrant out for your arrest. I had to cross them off so they wouldn't harass me for contributing to the deliquency.

 

[naesco]

Chip:

Just say no to blue tang.

I did it for your own good. The Tang Police already have a warrant out for your arrest. I had to cross them off so they wouldn't harass me for contributing to the deliquency.

Great attitude and great advice Jt.

Steve you are wrong again.
The sky IS falling: haven't you noticed; species by species;
Imagine! Industry losers unable to get get blue tang from their cheap cyanide suppliers in the Philippines now have to turn to net caught suppliers :roll:

 

[Anonymous]

Great attitude and great advice Jt.

Errr...I believe he was kidding...

:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

Peace,

Chip

 

[clarionreef]

Goodness,
Cyanide dealers having to turn to netcaught blue tangs! How did it come to this!
You're right Wayne...It is a classic indicator species that has fallen.
Dealers are philosophers of economic determinism though and will insist on the last and final blue tang as their right to sell! They will covet the crowbar supply also.
And it is all of course not ethics driven or environmentally based...and it never will be. Eco groups now ride with the trade as comensal organisms.
Would they ever sound the alarm? Of course not. They're sleeping with the enemy now.
Soon the supply will come from beyond the cyanide trade and reside with the crowbar boys.
Steve

 

[JT]

Great attitude and great advice Jt.

Errr...I believe he was kidding...

I was? :?:

I am actually quite serious on my Hepatus position. I'm going to start crossing them off of orders and telling my customers to "just say no". Don't like it, tough.

 

[Fish_dave]

Great idea J.T. Cross off the blue tangs from your customers orders which will cause your customers to go looking for blue tangs elsewhere. A lot of the wholesale demand for blue tangs is caused by wholesalers wanting to have blue tangs when the other guys do not. They put huge pressure on suppliers to come up with blue tangs at any cost so that they can lure customers away from their competetors by offering blue tangs when the other guys do not have them. When you cross off the blue tangs from your customers orders the customer will call down the street and tell the other guys that he will place an order with them if he can supply some blue tangs. The other guys then call their suppliers and ask for blue tangs at any price so that they can steal your customer by offering blue tangs. It just feeds the cycle. I have seen it happen several times.

If you want to do something then get your boss to stop ordering blue tangs from the suspect suppliers and get them from a sustainable source. They are out there if he is willing to look for them. Price has been the big issue in the past with your getting blue tangs, I know as I used to supply them to you guys years ago.

Dave

 

[JT]

If you want to do something then get your boss to stop ordering blue tangs from the suspect suppliers and get them from a sustainable source.

Easier said then done. You know how stubborn some people are in this industry.

Also, I don't merely cross them off and ignore it. I then try to educate the customer if he/she is willing to listen. If they want Blue Tang bad enough, they'll do whatever they have to do to buy them.

 

[Anonymous]

I was? :?:

Well, what's this?

I did it for your own good. The Tang Police already have a warrant out for your arrest. I had to cross them off so they wouldn't harass me for contributing to the deliquency.

Sounds like you're not being too serious there.

I am actually quite serious on my Hepatus position. I'm going to start crossing them off of orders and telling my customers to "just say no". Don't like it, tough.

If I want blue tangs for my order, I should be able to get blue tangs. If they're not healthy-looking, then fine. However, if they're healthy and you still 'cross them off' my order, then that's not good.

Peace,

Chip

 

[Anonymous]

Easier said then done. You know how stubborn some people are in this industry.

Yeah, like sales reps with Hepatus positions.

Also, I don't merely cross them off and ignore it. I then try to educate the customer if he/she is willing to listen.

You don't need to educate me. I need blue tangs for my customers.

If they want Blue Tang bad enough, they'll do whatever they have to do to buy them.

I thought I did...I put it on my order.

Peace,

Chip

 

[Fish_dave]

Fair enough JT. Good luck in educating customers, it is tough to do when money is involved and most in this industry seem to see blue tangs as money not as fish.

Dave

 

[Anonymous]

Fair enough JT. Good luck in educating customers, it is tough to do when money is involved and most in this industry seem to see blue tangs as money not as fish.

Dave

isn't all livestock seen as money in the industry ?


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