New to reef set up

[aljndrno]

Hi,
I've had saltwater aquariums in the past, but I stopped the hobby for quite sometime and I want to get back into it. I recently acquired a 55 gallon glass tank with stand. It also came with a fluval 404 filter.

I want to set it up as a reef/fish tank. It's currently set up with play sand and some live rocks. The filter seems to be doing a good job of cleaning the water. It's been set up a week, it seemed to have gone through a cycle (water got cloudy, cleared up a couple of times). I think I still remember how it was back in the ancient times.

Things have changed quite a bit since, so my question is...Is it possible to do what I want with this tank with the existing filter I have? I have limited space between the wall and the tank (I would rather not have an overflow in and out of the back of the tank. I'm open to having a wet/dry or sump filter, but I just can't have an overflow tank hanging from the back that's why the fluval is handy with just the hoses hanging from the back). I was also thinking about getting another fluval filter if what I have cannot handle the reef.

Any suggestions are welcomed. Comments and criticisms are welcome too, but only if they're constructive.

Thanks for looking.
:lol:

 

[ChrisRD]

Hi and :welcome:

Personally, I would keep the canister filter on hand for periodically running carbon or detritus removal but I wouldn't run it full time. I highly recommend getting a good skimmer. Also, make sure to add a few powerheads to the tank - good circulation is critical to a healthy reef tank.

The only way you can have a sump or run a skimmer without having something hanging on the back of your tank would be to get it drilled (or drill it yourself) and install a bulkhead to plumb a drain and/or internal overflow box. In this case (standard glass 55 gallon) the bottom is probably tempered but the back may not be depending on the tank manufacturer. If the back is not, it could be drilled for the bulkhead (NEVER attempt to drill tempered glass). Since the tank is already setup you'd have to relocate the live rock and sand to a holding container temporarily to have this done.

If you don't want to be bothered with any of that, the other options would be to get a hang-on skimmer or a hang-on overflow (so you can setup a sump and use an in-sump skimmer). Either way, however, you're going to have something hanging off the back (or side) of your tank...

You might want to take a look at this guide in our library - particularly the section on filtration.
http://www.reefs.org/library/newbieguide.htm

HTH

 

[SnowManSnow]

i agree...

i had to get it in my head when i got started too.. if you're gonna have a reef tank you need reef equipment

B

 

[aljndrno]

Hi Chris,
Thanks for the quick response. I don't think I want to go the drilling route. I would like to avoid that at all cost. The other option I was thinking of was to get a sump without the overflow, is that something that is possible to do? Just have a couple of hoses hanging from the back directly to the sump (again that's because I really have limited space between the wall and the tank, I can't move the tank further away from the wall)?

How does a hanging skimmer help with the situation I'm in? Can you explain the set up when you said...

"If you don't want to be bothered with any of that, the other options would be to get a hang-on skimmer or a hang-on overflow (so you can setup a sump and use an in-sump skimmer). Either way, however, you're going to have something hanging off the back (or side) of your tank... "

I can probably secure the skimmer to the side of the tank with silicon, please expain how this will work with my current set up. Can I attach the skimmer inline with the fluval? Help please! :?:

 

[Anonymous]

Yep, do it right as you can the first time. It's painfull after you start to go back and change stuff.

 

[Anonymous]

siphon some of that water into a few 5 ga buckets and move that sucker. you have more options by doing that.

 

[Meloco14]

How many inches of clearance do you have between the back of the tank and the wall? If you have room for hoses back there you probably have room to get a hang-on overflow. A hang-on overflow is essentially a box that has a tube running down to the sump. Some people use these without a problem. Others swear they are a flooding risk that just isn't worth it. Drilling the tank is a much safer way to go, but obviously more work. A hang-on skimmer is a skimmer that is similar to any hang-on power filter you've probably seen in that it hangs on the lip of the tank, sucks water in from the tank and spits it right back out into the tank. If you have 5" or so between the tank and wall you can find a skimmer to fit. If you don't mind having it hanging off the side of the tank that is an option also. This is only needed if you don't use a sump, though. If you have a sump just get an in-sump skimmer and that will be that.

 

[Meloco14]

This link shows a hang-on overflow to the sump:

http://www.premiumaquatics.com/Merchant ... PROverflow

This one shows a good hang-on skimmer:

http://www.premiumaquatics.com/Merchant ... Code=AquaC

 

[SnowManSnow]

I think Chris was talking about a HOT skimmer. If there's no room for it on the back can u put it on the side?

B

 

[ChrisRD]

The other option I was thinking of was to get a sump without the overflow, is that something that is possible to do? Just have a couple of hoses hanging from the back directly to the sump (again that's because I really have limited space between the wall and the tank, I can't move the tank further away from the wall)?

No, that won't work - the overflow is needed if you want a sump.

How does a hanging skimmer help with the situation I'm in? Can you explain the set up when you said...

It's a skimmer that hangs right on the side or back of the tank - no sump needed. No drilling, no overflow, etc. - you just hang it on the tank and plug it in.

I can probably secure the skimmer to the side of the tank with silicon, please expain how this will work with my current set up.

No need - they just hang on the side or back of the tank like any hang-on power filter.

Can I attach the skimmer inline with the fluval? Help please! :?:

No, they're not intended to be connected - two completely separate filters. Personally I would run the skimmer 24/7 and take the canister off. As mentioned earlier, I would use the canister periodically as needed but I wouldn't run it continously. If it's not cleaned very frequently it will ultimately do more harm than good IME.

 

[aljndrno]

Thank you all for your recommendations and encouragement. I will do it right, and do it right the first time. I will move the tank about 5 inches forward this weekend.

Chris I will run the fluval until I get the wet/dry filter system. I will wait and be patient. Since the tank is new, I assume that this is okay to clean out the tank with the fluval.

I added more live rocks and a couple of Rio 1000 powerheads into the tank as well for better circulation.

Thank you all and keep the suggestions coming.

 

[ChrisRD]

My advice is to skip the wet/dry and invest in a quality protein skimmer. The live rock + a good skimmer + lots of circulation is the best form of filtration for a reef IME.

From the beginner guide I linked earlier in the thread (definitely worth taking the time to read it):
"Biomedia (bioballs, filter floss, etc) is also generally not used any more. These will cause a great deal of aerobic degredation of ammonia to nitrate, but the nitrate is the end product which causes it to build up in the system to levels that can cause stress to corals."

HTH

 

[aljndrno]

Hi Chris,
I'm sorry to be so ignorant about this, but things sure have changed since I last took up the hobby. Please clarify this for me. For a filtration system, all I need is a good protein skimmer and powerheads? That's it? I read the beginners guide. There's so much to choose from for filtration I got confused as to which one to pick.

I'm planning to have inverts, coral and fish in my tank eventually.

Thanks.

 

[ChrisRD]

For a filtration system, all I need is a good protein skimmer and powerheads? That's it?

Well, the live rock and/or live sand are a critical part of the system too (they provide the biological filtration) - but yes, as far as filtration equipment - the skimmer and powerheads are basically all that's required. IMO wet/dry filters are best left to freshwater or fish-only saltwater setups.

 

[aljndrno]

Ok. I think I've got it. Do you have a recommendation on protein skimmers? Do they make one that you can hide in the stand?

Thanks.

 

[ChrisRD]

If you're going to have a sump, look into ASM - they are tough to beat for the money.
http://www.asmskimmer.com/

If you're not going to have a sump, something like the AquaC Remora Pro would work.
http://www.proteinskimmer.com/productsnew.htm

Of course there are plenty of other good choices out there - those are just some examples.

HTH

 

[bleedingthought]

I definitely second Chris's advice on skimmers!

 

[aljndrno]

Hello again.
I finally got myself a prizm protein skimmer (that was the only skimmer that my LFS had in stock). I hope I didn't make the wrong choice. I'm still adjusting it, but was amazed at the dirt it took off over night.

I also disconnect the fluval system but left the tubes in the tank. Is this okay?

One other thing, I bought a star fish, a cleaner shrimp, 3 snails and hermit crabs along with the skimmer. I noticed the hermit crabs eating the cleaner shrimp after about 3 hours in the tank. It was odd because the cleaner shrimp was in the same tank I bought the hermit crabs from. Did the cleaner shrimp die because my tank was not ready for it? I wouldn't have expected the shrimp to die after 3 hours. I tested for ammonia before I bought the livestock and it tested zero. But after I saw the dead shrimp I tested ammonia again and it read 0.25. Can someone enlighten me on my situation?

Many thanks.

 

[bleedingthought]

There are better hang-on skimmers, but that's just my opinion.

Well, you've only had the tank setup for 3 weeks, right? What are your other parameters? Especially nitrite, nitrate, temperature, and salinity. Did you acclimate the shrimp? They can be really sensitive to new tanks and bad acclimation. And what kind of star did you buy?

 

[aljndrno]

Thanks for the reply. Yes, my tank has only been set up about 3 weeks. The ammonia was the only one I tested for before I bought the livestock, I guess it was irresponsible of me to do just that. I did acclimate the new livestock for about an hour before getting them into the tank. I poured little amounts of the water from my tank into the bag every 15 minutes as well. I took the shrimp out of the bag and dropped it in the tank after an hour.

The temperature I had set for the tank fluctuates due to the recent hot weather, it's been between 78F and 80F, salinity is at 1.023. I have brown diatoms everywhere. The yellow polyps and tiny feather dusters that came with one of the live rocks I bought are doing fine. There's even a yellow polyps that split from the rest and is growing out of the sand. This is what made me decide to buy the shrimp.

Anyway, sorry to be so long winded, but I guess I'm trying to justify the shrimp purchase. I also have a blue linka starfish.

Thanks.