Wet Dry or Sump in 75g FOWLR?

[Dj Orion]

First off, thanks to everyone who helped me get this unit (i got alot of responses and help). For everyone who has no clue what I am talking about, my 75g FOWLR filter broke, and I was desperatly looking for a replacement filter/sump. Well Nycmat hooked me up with the money wet dry, and we were discussing what route I should take to filter this FOWLR?

Should I set it up as the old skool wet dry with bio balls and trickle down system? Or shold I gut it, and make it a sump, with possible live sand and live rock with chaeto?

Keep in mind that the tank holds 3 triggers, 2 puffers and a lion, so they are messy and produce tremeandous waste. The tank is a 75g and I allready have a skimmer rated for a 125g, and over 90 pounds of tonga/figi live rock, and 15w UV. I wont being putting corals or inverts in there any time soon. I also have nitrate and phosphate issues right now, so keep that in mind. Any input would be great, I plan on setting this up between tonite and tomorrow.

 

[Awibrandy]

Dj, what I have done for my FOWLR's filtration is as follows; I removed all of the bio/balls and plates.
The first chamber is where the drain from the tank drains into, and that is also where the pump to the skimmer sits.
The second chamber is where the skimmer, heater, and carbon sit(will be getting a phosban reactor to run the carbon through in the near future).
The third chamber is where the return pump sits.

Now here is the catch, the tank is the 120 that was recently installed. So I cannot tell you how well, or not it is working. So far all looks good.
:shhh:I didn't throw the bio/balls away though:shhh: Just incase.
Good luck buddy! Oh yeah, when is it that your coming over?

 

[Dj Orion]

Damn Awi, looks like you are the only one that wants to touch this one. I am gonna go with the sump method. The first chamber I am gonna use for my uv, a thick layer of live sand, and heater. The main chamber I am gonna use chaeto, live rock and more live sand (if I can figure out a way to keep it from getting sucked up back into the pvc) I may have to create a second partition. I will post a pic later on tontie.

Awi lets meet half way and do lunch!

 

[Awibrandy]

We really should! But then we won't get to see each other's tank.

I wouldn't put sand in the first compartment where the water drains into from the tank. I would imagine it will go flying from the water pressure.
The middle compartment you can block off by placing a piece of acrylic at the end where the sponge was.

 

[Davidl919]

Yeah Sump is best, you can go with awi suggestion of not putting sand in the drain compartment. I actually use a drain compartment with sand, live rock rubble, and cheatos together but sump is high. I use the middle section for return and two reactors one for phosphate the other for carbon and the third compartment a filter sock and the protein skimmer.

 

[DevIouS]

Use the wet/dry as a sump for your equipment, but do not bother using sand or macro algae in there. It will have zero effect in your type of system.
If you are having a Nitrate & Phosphate problem, the only way you can have it under control is by water changes & a Phos Reactor.
BTW: This is a FOWLR, so you shouldn't be concerning yourself much with Phosphates.

 

[Dj Orion]

ok,
so i removed the bio balls and stuff and made a custom partition bubble trap divider with acrylic in the wet dry. The divider was actually a problem so I had to cut it down because it wasnt giving off enough flow to the pump. I added 20lbs of live sand to the center chamber and am going to add more live rock as well. The "quiet one" pump is far from quiet imo and my next hurtle is figuring out how to deal with that. Now as for the phosphates and nitrates, I am very concearned with them because I have an insane amount of hair algae growing on the live rock. I have tried several methods and get nowhere fast. In my last attempt to battle this problem I am going to get a phosban reactor and I think I will add chaeto as well (now that i officially have a sump). (stop me now if you think this is a bad idea) As for the setup, I am just trying to figure out how to lower the volume on that damn pump. I guess I am going to have to add some sort of insulation under the tank to absorb the volume of pump buzzing and water splashing. (the buzz does not come from pump vibration, it seems to be from the pump itself)

 

[Chiefmcfuz]

I would say either or is fine this is a fowlr system not a reef so the req's aren't as stringent.

 

[Awibrandy]

Which is why I gave my suggestion Chief.

Dj a sump with ls/lr, and chaeto does not necessarily fix your algea problem. When I had the sump/fuge on my reef is when I had my biggest problem with hair algea. I got rid of the fuge, added 2 reactors(1 carbon, the other runs phosar), started using ro/di, and no more algea.
But that is my reef, who knows maybe a fuge will work for you. What's the worse that can happen? You try it, it doesn't work you get rid of it.
Noise pump, umh, you can try the foam thing. But if the noise is not coming from vibrations how do you figuer it will work? I don't understand.

 

[Dj Orion]

umh, you can try the foam thing. But if the noise is not coming from vibrations how do you figuer it will work? I don't understand.

I am thinking that I gotta make some sort of casing or something for this pump just to dampen the buzzing that comes from it. I mean, it borders on sounding like an electric toothbrush, or other cylindrical devices that also buzz like an electric toothbrush.... :scratch:

Maybe I can put a few layers of socks on it and hope for the best.

 

[Awibrandy]

I am thinking that I gotta make some sort of casing or something for this pump just to dampen the buzzing that comes from it. I mean, it borders on sounding like an electric toothbrush, or other cylindrical devices that also buzz like an electric toothbrush.... :scratch:

Maybe I can put a few layers of socks on it and hope for the best.

Don't forget these external pumps need to breath. Wouldn't want you to burn out your pump, or worse start a fire. Be careful. Ask the guys here on what are your options on deadning that noise.
Just to let you know, I had a little giant making loud whirling sound. I called the manufacture had them listen to it over the phone lines, and they told me the pump was on it's way out.:banghead:

 

[1UCKY]

I myself had a huge Nitrate problem in my 180 FOWLR a few months ago. I removed all my bio balls (a little at a time) from the second chamber and replaced it with some Mangroves. I then went ahead and filled the remaining space with live rock rubble. I also added a light over Mangroves and live rock. Till this day my Nitrate levels have been 10ppm. Hope this helps.

 

[Dj Orion]

yeah so last nite i came home from work and in the process of fiddling with my skimmer i accidentally knocked the power cable of the pump in the sump. I thought in my head, no worries, i just put in a brand new overflow box, everything will be ok. NOT!

Long story short, I spent about 3 hours cleaning up all of the water that spilled out of my sump under my tank stand and living room floor. The pump also shorted out and now dosent work at all.

I ordered a new pump last nite and am hoping for better luck with this one. I am also thinking of using the pump as a submersible in sump fixture, as opposed to the way i previously had it set up. I dont know why my overflow didnt seem to work out the way I thought it would. It is a hang on, and a really nice one also. I think I got a few more grey hairs after this past week, let me tell you. :letitallo

 

[DevIouS]

Has nothing to do with the overflow.

Either your sump is too small to handle the back-flow or your return pipe is way below water level & there's nothing to break the siphon.

The water level in your tank will drain as far as the out-put of the return pipe.

 

[Dj Orion]

for real at this point, i feel like throwing the whole thing out and just sticking with my nano. I just am not having any luck with this new setup. The sump should def be big enough (barely fits under the tank) and as far as the return, it is at the very top of the sump. (return meaing the flow into the sump from the tank) The out flow from the pump is at the bottom of the sump tank. There isnt much room from the flow coming from the tank in the sump, I was actually going to add pvc to help keep it from making a loud splashing sound all the time. I would love to post pics, and will try to tonite, but it is really cramped under there, and I dont know if i'll be able to get a good camera shot.

 

[DevIouS]

The return is from your sump going into your main tank....drain is what is coming from your main tank going into the sump.
I'm confused on your set-up.

Pics will be best to give further advice.

 

[DevIouS]

Here is a pic of Dj's nano.

Nano?!?

We're talking about a 75 gal FOWLR here...


Arent we?

 

[Dj Orion]

ok ok. I have 2 tanks, a nano and a 75g fowlr. The nano has nothing to do with what we were discussing. I have a converted wet dry running with 1" pvc and hoses with a Quiet one 780 gph pump. here is a pic that i took with my phone before i set it up. Its not great but it may help to clear up any confusion.

It is full of bags with bio balls in it. Obviously I took those out. You cant see it well, but on the opposite end of the sump, towards the top is where the water current flows into the sump

 

[DevIouS]

Correct.
Now on the opposite side where the gate valve is (& your pump should get connected to), is the "return" which pumps water back into the tank.
How do you have that connected?

It's plumbed back to the main tank & at the end should be a return pipe or Loc-Line.
Then it goes back to my above post:

return pipe is way below water level & there's nothing to break the siphon.

The water level in your tank will drain as far as the out-put of the return pipe.

 

[Awibrandy]

My mistake Phil! I agree with you that the problem is the returns are sucking ther water out of the tank. Try raising the returns in the tank a little higher.

What I did with my fowlr is I turned the lockline in an upwards direction as far as I could get it, then I turned the nozzle in a downward position back into the tank. No more floods after that. I also had to turn my drain upwards a little as well.

But then again I'm not sure that I am understanding exactly what happened.
Here is what I understood happened. The pump failed consecuently you ended up with a flood. If I understood correctly then the above should work if your able to raise your return line a bit further up in the tank itself.