I went to visit a pet shop and I was told

[KathyC]

Not actually, You should still test your water from and RO DI TDS do not measure everything they are simply a measurment of conductivity. If you had some pesticides and some chemicals in your water and your RO is not working properly a TDS meter would not detect it.

Nor would anyone know. That's why we test with the TDS, which measures Total Disolved Solids even though it doesn't tell us specifically what those are. The reaction to that reading should be changing out the cartridges on the unit, so that it IS working properly.

What chemicals are you testing your water for Wxl?

 

[jhale]

If your tap water is high quality, you can use it to set up your tank...the problems come in the top off. Chemicals that are only found in trace amounts will accumulate as water is added to replace evaporation... I can see how an LFS could get by with high quality tap water, as they are probably (hopefully?) making frequent water changes...its not in the water changes, but in the top off.

This does not make sense to me. Why would topping off with tap water be any worse than doing water changes with it, or setting up a tank with it?
If you set up your tank with tap water in NY your going to be starting with a PO4 reading of 2.0-3.0, that's no good. Why not start with RO/DI with 0.00 Po4 and avoid the headaches?
I would avoid using tap water at any expense.

 

[Aqua Pro Builder]

Thats interesting, Wingo, because most of the things I have read have stated that NYC has one of the best municpal water supplies in the country. Many problems originate from old piping in the many very old buildings we have. That being said, a recent NYTimes report revealed that most municipal water systems in the country have trace amounts of many many different pharmaceuticals ( Prozac was one of, if not the, top ). After giving everyone a good scare, though, they went on to say that even though the levels are detectable, they are far below those known to produce any effects.

"in the country" it said, and I said "other countries."

There was a time when I suddenly lost 14lbs in one week with high fever (114F) and went to the medical system of my school. 3 doctors diagnosed my case. Each, I had to tell the story of what I had been doing in the recent past. The first two doctors(including myself) suspected I caught parasites over the vacation in the other countries. While the last doctor did not bother to further investigate into that possibility once I told him the city I was staying and he went to diagnose with test for hyper thyroid. He is right on. He then told me the water of New York is not as good as we want to believe.

Another personal experience with the water system in NYC. I used to own a building in Bushwick and the whole street were tasting oil in the drinking water oftenly. So, I called DEP to inspect. When I called again, they said, "The water is safe and did not find the oil taste. Interestingly, not a single superintendent in the street, nor a person who reported the oil taste had seen an DEP inspector(we have to open the door for them to come in.) I installed water filters for the building but still the taste was there. At the time, I did not know of DI for water treatment.

I received info from both NYC State DEP and NYC DEP that there was another incident involve, NY State DEP suing NYC DEP of withholding the fact of a failing water treatment system from the public about 2 years ago. NY State DEP have issued guild lines that the city MUST disclose to the public about water treatment system failure.

So what that boils down are,
1)when the system is working, our water could be very good in accord to other press releases thinking the water is good in NYC
2)however, we are not notified of the failures and problems, base on my personal experience and that the fact State have to sued the City for withholding the truth of system failure-direct violation of the a State regulation.
3)the water quality could differ greatly from area to area within the city because as point (1)stated, when the system is working, our drinking water could be very good but if the samples are taken in an area where problem exist and the city ignores to correct it, it could be hell. Think of drinking water with oil taste on/off for over a year or more.
4)some people in NYC DEP thinks that I am a lunatics while many think that I am a whistle blower because I keep on reporting strange phenomenons or sightings to them including strange wild bird death and abnormal behavior of the mosquitoes in Flushing(like the West Nile Virus Leak Scandal) before it become a scandal.

 

[BZOFIQ]

I use tap since day one and have no problems at all. I have no space in my small apartment to run a RO water treatment "facility". I don't keep any SPS corals only concetrate on softies only. I don;t dose anything except ocasional alk and iodine and my tank looks (looked) GREAT. I have no plans to use RO water in the near future.

 

[ellebelle]

I use tap since day one and have no problems at all. I have no space in my small apartment to run a RO water treatment "facility". I don't keep any SPS corals only concetrate on softies only. I don;t dose anything except ocasional alk and iodine and my tank looks (looked) GREAT. I have no plans to use RO water in the near future.

Could we see a full tank shot?

 

[meschaefer]

Could we see a full tank shot?

Ditto... but I did notice a past tense in his statement


"my tank looks (looked) GREAT"

 

[tommy818]

the bottom line is the corals we keep in our tanks come from pristine waters.in order for them to thrive we must try and duplicate there natural enviorment.using tap water u could never accomplish that.

 

[BZOFIQ]

the bottom line is the corals we keep in our tanks come from pristine waters.in order for them to thrive we must try and duplicate there natural enviorment.using tap water u could never accomplish that.

^^^ You have a good point, however I never expirienced any problems with the tank, never had any algea (except koraline and cheto in the fuge) therefore I never needed to setup RO.

 

[BZOFIQ]

Could we see a full tank shot?

I don't see why not. This was the last shot before I listed the tank and stand for sale about 3 weeks ago. I moved 2 weeks ago and now everything is sitting in 2 150G tubs (let me know if you need pictures too).

Pics were taken late at night so a lot of stuff was already closed when I put the lights back on but here are the pics.

Here is the fuge, even the new pieces of eggcrate already started to purple up.

 

[NavyNano212]

Water

Just to add to the thread...I am a nano reefer and have found using the Catalina water from Petco to be excellent. Also, quite the value. I have done test on it before adding to the tank and it tests great each time. Of course, I only replace 5 gallons at a time, so it is perfect for me. Larger water changes might find it cumbersome.
For my top off water, I used to use distilled, now I use ZERO water. It tests 0 on my TDS meter and it really made for the kitchen and to drink. But, I called them and they said it is perfect for fish tanks as well.
Just my thoughts...

 

[Aqua Pro Builder]

I don't see why not. This was the last shot before I listed the tank and stand for sale about 3 weeks ago. I moved 2 weeks ago and now everything is sitting in 2 150G tubs (let me know if you need pictures too).

Pics were taken late at night so a lot of stuff was already closed when I put the lights back on but here are the pics.

Here is the fuge, even the new pieces of eggcrate already started to purple up.

You beat me to posting it.

I am about to ask you for pics just to compare mine (not challenging you).


To be polite this is mine at 31 days, hope I can find some recent ones.

The Xenia grow from 3, 4 stalks to the ones as pic in 31 days and then suddenly all die couple months later.
The frog spawn grew so much that I sold 4 times the same size as pictured
I know some stars(or even snails of some sort) are eating them but cannot remember what's the final destiny of it
Cabbage grew very quickly in this tank and was also sold but the new keeper seems unable to keep it up, it's getting smaller in his tank
The cup coral grew much bigger in the same tank that cannot keep the cabbage well enough.
The sun also grew a little bit and I fragged them and sold after a year. The keeper above got a pcs but cannot keep up with this coral either, he losted couple heads but not dying as shown in some sun polyps for sale threads.
Oh, the most interesting one is the pale looking small frogspawn to the right, after two years, it's the same size as in my tank and the new keeper's tank whom I gave it to.

Now questions,
How long have the tank been running using tap water when the pic is taken? I just want to keep a visual memory of the effect of tap water tank.

Would you characterize your macro growth fast, or slow or can you even give more precise description?

Once again don't take it wrongly that I am challenging you. The one tank I shown you has been running tap water since 2005 to end of 2007. I just want to compare.

 

[BZOFIQ]

The tank you see in the pictures has been running since September of 2005 (or was it 04???). At first it was just bunch of rocks and couple of small frags ( have to find picture of those ). I try growing everything from small frags, cause its fun to see a 4x6 rock full of polyps from just 5 zoas on a plug. I have plenty of growth (considering that I only have 216W of regular T5s over a 135G tank) and I have donated frags and larger corals to both BAS and my close friends.

As far as my macro, lets put it this way. Calurpa was growing out of proportions and I was pulling out a lot both for my friends and to throw out. The "colony" was brought down to a fist size clump when I mistakingly placed a long spined urchin in the fuge because it was downsizing my green sinularia coral from 9" to about 2-3" until I figured who the culprit was. Well, it nearly ate all the calurpa before I gave him to my friend.

I switched to cheto fearing for blowout and the cheto has been growing at a slower pace.

I use tap water from day one for both make up water (~3Gallons every 3 Days) as well as for water changes (every 6 weeks ~40Gallons)

If you need more info, just ask.

 

[Aqua Pro Builder]

The tank you see in the pictures has been running since September of 2005 (or was it 04???). At first it was just bunch of rocks and couple of small frags ( have to find picture of those ). I try growing everything from small frags, cause its fun to see a 4x6 rock full of polyps from just 5 zoas on a plug. I have plenty of growth (considering that I only have 216W of regular T5s over a 135G tank) and I have donated frags and larger corals to both BAS and my close friends.

As far as my macro, lets put it this way. Calurpa was growing out of proportions and I was pulling out a lot both for my friends and to throw out. The "colony" was brought down to a fist size clump when I mistakingly placed a long spined urchin in the fuge because it was downsizing my green sinularia coral from 9" to about 2-3" until I figured who the culprit was. Well, it nearly ate all the calurpa before I gave him to my friend.

I switched to cheto fearing for blowout and the cheto has been growing at a slower pace.

I use tap water from day one for both make up water (~3Gallons every 3 Days) as well as for water changes (every 6 weeks ~40Gallons)

If you need more info, just ask.

Did you ever have sudden melt down of the macro algae. I am trying to see if the tap water could be culprit for at least one case of mysterious macro algae melt down in that tank which I think leads to the disappearing of the xenia.

 

[BZOFIQ]

Did you ever have sudden melt down of the macro algae. I am trying to see if the tap water could be culprit for at least one case of mysterious macro algae melt down in that tank which I think leads to the disappearing of the xenia.

No mysterious wipeouts here.

I've had Xenia grow like a grass in front of the building only to wipeout within days. That however I attributed to my less than perfect water changes/Not tap water or macro wipeout.

Two things about xenias; they hate lower salinity and they hate change in salinity.

When I change water I'd do about 25% (40-45 gallons out of about 160 total). I mix salt roughly 6-6.5 glasses to a drum. The salinity is not always the same. I don't have the time to spend hours doing water changes, so knowing my system I just stay away from Xenias. Just like I wouldn't attempt SPS with 1.6W per gallon. You just have to know your/your system limits. I have very small fish load and I feed very little. If I forget to feed today, I don't make up the next day.

Once again, never had any algae problems and as far as my clelaning crew goes my tank only supported about 15-20 tiny hermits, 3fire shrimp, 5 cone snails and 5 nassarius snails. Anything on top of that would day of starvation.

 

[meschaefer]

Not a bad pic...

It looks like your running a phosban reactor... any carbon?

 

[BZOFIQ]

Not a bad pic...

It looks like your running a phosban reactor... any carbon?

Thank you.

I don't run any reactors, too clumsy and makes the sump area too crowded. I do however have a bag filled with carbon and another bag filled with PhosGuard which I change every 2 months or whenever I remember. PhosGuard actually gets changed about twice a year.

 

[tommy818]

looks like u have mostly softies from your pics u could never keep sps or clams with this practice nor would i reccommend this practice to anyone starting out.as far as never having algae u have been very fortunate.

 

[Aqua Pro Builder]

looks like u have mostly softies from your pics u could never keep sps or clams with this practice nor would i reccommend this practice to anyone starting out.as far as never having algae u have been very fortunate.

Well like he said, he knows his tank limit, so he is not keeping SPS.

However, I do keep some easy ones and those ppl hate (because I think aggressiveness.) Cactus, favia(SPS?), moon(SPS?), 2 encrusting type SPS which I have no idea what's their names. A finger nail size cap died due to falling off the mount being buried in the sand. Bird's Nest frag was eaten by a hitch hiker crab which i like more than the SPS.

At the beginning I try the phosband thing that comes from the deal when I bought the tank but after I finish the 1/4 cup of it. I did not bother to get supply anymore. I do not have algae outbreak either.

 

[Aqua Pro Builder]

Two things about xenias; they hate lower salinity and they hate change in salinity.

Hmm, I have not paid attention to that at the time.

 

[BZOFIQ]

looks like u have mostly softies from your pics u could never keep sps or clams with this practice nor would i reccommend this practice to anyone starting out.as far as never having algae u have been very fortunate.

Correct, I love softies and have kept them since day one. There is nothing better than seeing pulsing xenia or anthelia (which I have a large colony of) swaying back and forth with the current.

Now that is not to say SPS aren't beautifull, but they just don't do it for me. I like the motion in the ocean

Now you probably think that I wouldn't be able to keep SPS due to my water quality which is far from true. The reason lies more in the type/amount of light I use. I don't want $300/month bills so I went with regular T5s (HO T5s were scarce at that point) which give me only about 1.6W/gallon. As to the water quality, while I am sure it's not perfect and wouldn't allow me to keep more "demanding" species I'd like for you to know that I do have two montipora somethingpora in two different colors in the tank (purple and green). They have no problem surviving in the tank as they are propped at the highest point in the tank (right beneth the lights) Their growth is slow but who cares, I trim my softies all the time.


As far as recommending the tap water to anyone, I am not per se recommending it. All I am saying is that you can have a sucessful reef tank without the use of RO, I've seen plenty.