The Scientific Answer to why my Cal/Alk are out of wack

[JLAudio]

Ive been doing 10% water changes religously on my 54 gallon reef, dose esv 2 part accordingly (but havent lately because calcium was so high, and alk low to normal) so ive been just dosing alk, after being told bring that up would help. I tested salifert, AP, Instant Ocean and all had me at 500+ in calcium with a normal reading of Alk 3-3.5 mEq/l (8.4-9.8 DKH), how could this be, so I did more water changes thinking this would help

Then just the other day I was told maybe its magnesium levels, so I consider this, but then they were tested in LFS and were perfectly in range for magnesium.

At last after reading another reef/fish forum I come upon some salt brand test results (I know we have done it here as well) and I look up my brand CORALIFE

The results
Here is a list of what I measured for the big three in a number of the salt mixes we use today. This is intended as a guideline and I, in no way, guarantee these figures. All I can say is they were all tested under the same conditions, with a number of different brand test kits, using the same methods for each test. I believe these numbers are reasonably what you can expect from these salts mixed at 35 ppt or 1.0264
(chart did not come out well on post, so # indicated as follows)

1)Calcium ​

2)Alkalinity ​

3)Magnesium​

Aquatic Gardens
430
8
1240
CoraLife
560
9
1380
Crystal Sea Marinemix
340
9
1050
Crystal Sea Marinemix Bio-Assay
340
9
1050
Instant Ocean
350
12
1070
Kent
540
11
1200
Marine Environment
480
7.5
1450
Oceanic
580
8.5
1650
OceanPure
510
10
1320
Red Sea
400
8
1300
Red Sea Coral Pro
490
7
1300
Reef Crystals
420
12
1260
SeaChem Marine Salt
500
10
1400
SeaChem Reef Salt
540
10
1450
Tropic Marin
375
10
1230
Tropic Marin Pro Reef
450
8.5
1380
Tunze Reef Salt
420
9.5
1350

A special thanks to Bertoni for putting it in nice form.



My range is out of wack, because of my damn salt 560/9 (Exactly where im at)! So the more Im doing water changes to correct it the more it keeps me in this 500+ cal and normal alk range

 

[JLAudio]

So this being said, if I continue my consistant WC process and have a 500+ cal level, is that detremential to the corals?

 

[meschaefer]

No, it is not detrimental to the corals. Depending on your overall tank needs and the frequency of your water changes, you may not need to dose Alk and Calcium equally.


You say that you are dosing B-Ionic "accordingly", what doe you mean by "accordingly". Are you just following the dosing instructions on the bottle, or have you calculated your tanks daily usage and dose based upon that?

The other thing I notice about those levels is that he Magnesium is not balanced with the Calcium. Magnesium should be three times Calcium. What this means to me is that your Calcium may precipitate out of your tank until it equals out. The Alk looks balanced, but I honestly would need to look at a chart to determine that.

 

[JLAudio]

No, it is not detrimental to the corals. Depending on your overall tank needs and the frequency of your water changes, you may not need to dose Alk and Calcium equally.


You say that you are dosing B-Ionic "accordingly", what doe you mean by "accordingly". Are you just following the dosing instructions on the bottle, or have you calculated your tanks daily usage and dose based upon that?

The other thing I notice about those levels is that he Magnesium is not balanced with the Calcium. Magnesium should be three times Calcium. What this means to me is that your Calcium may precipitate out of your tank until it equals out. The Alk looks balanced, but I honestly would need to look at a chart to determine that.

By accordingly, Basically 4ml. per gallon, and testing at end of week. With doing this my alk went up from 2.5 mEq/l to 3 and is always pretty stable there, so Ive been staying with this. This week I purposely missed my water change and calcium, is around 450 as of last night, so today I began doing equal parts, alk/cal to maintain them and test in a cpl days, to make sure the amount is sufficient to keep them both stable.

Overall I think im going to opt for one of the other brands that is in perfect ratio, so I can always increase water changes to balance out levels, rather than having to fix inbalance that water change has caused.

BTW here is the link I got this info from:
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1287118

 

[meschaefer]

If your otherwise happy I wouldn't worry about it. I would be that if you dosed as normal following a water change that the system would balance itself out over a week or so.

I have kept my calcium level at 500 on purpose, but had to boost my Mg to 1500 and my Alk to over 10, in order to maintain the level. Even when attempting to keep it that high, I found that it would drop down to 450 in time.

 

[JLAudio]

If stability is important for growth then I think just maintaining the levels at the desired level would be better then waiting till inflated cal numbers deplete to normal, giving the reef a constant 50-100 calcium swing in a week, as well would make it necessary for me to dose alk and mag seperately.

I think a balanced salt would provide greater stablility, and would require me to only stabalize to proper level and not wait for optimal level to be achieved before stablizing

 

[meschaefer]

In my learned opinion, you will not see an determental effects from the swing, and you will not need to dose Mag and Alk separately.


Of course, do what your more comfortable with and if you feel that changing your salt will give you better results go ahead. To that end, what salt would you use?

 

[JLAudio]

Tropic Marin Pro Reef
450
8.5
1380
Tunze Reef Salt
420
9.5
1350
Aquatic Gardens
430
8
1240

These three seem to be in the correct ratio. I think it greatly simplifies things if you could re balance your system by water changes, and if your salt is in perfect ratio, with minimal dosing you will be in close to be perfect range, with minimal testing

 

[meschaefer]

Tropic Marin Pro Reef
450
8.5
1380
Tunze Reef Salt
420
9.5
1350
Aquatic Gardens
430
8
1240

These three seem to be in the correct ratio. I think it greatly simplifies things if you could re balance your system by water changes, and if your salt is in perfect ratio, with minimal dosing you will be in close to be perfect range, with minimal testing

I don't recall why, but I just read that Tropic Marin Pro Reef is recommended by the manufacturer to be used only when a Calcium Reactor is being used. I also know a few people who had major cyanobacteria outbreaks when using Tropic Marin Pro Reef, that subsided once the switched salts. I was going to use it at one time, based off the same study you cited, but decided not to once we figured out the cyano problem.

IMO Tunze salt is overpriced, but that is a personal decision. IMO all but the Tunze are low on Alkalinity, and would need to adjust that anyway. (at least where I like to keep it, close to 10)

I have never heard of Aquatic Gardens salt, and wouldn't use it for that reason. I know nothing about there quality control and I tend to stick with brands I know and trust.

As I said I think your fine, I wouldn't worry about the 500 calcium levels, I have purposefully kept my Calcium at that level.

 

[Wes]

4 ml of each part per gallon? That sounds extremely high

 

[JLAudio]

im sorry wes, its actually 1 ml. per 4 gallons. i wrote it out wrong (good eye)

 

[Wes]

ah ok that sounds better LOL

 

[JLAudio]

I also noticed, less algae when I avoided weekly WC. I have an oversized skimmer, reactor, chaeto etc. to keep nutrients down, but I will often get a algae film on front glass, and a little in the bottom corners especially since upgrading 250-400 MH, and that seems to have reduced and not developing. Hmmm, I would like to see the read out of phosphates in my salt, perhaps that is hurting more than helping