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Are there going to be MAC certified stingrays?
MAC Press Release for Finding Nemo Film
- Thread starter John_Brandt
- Start date
Are there going to be MAC certified stingrays?
Hi Mitch,
Creating a demand without having a supply falls right in line with everything else MAC has done, everything backwards.
BTW, the Pittsburgh Zoo & Aquarium has installed a device which constantly cleans the glass on your revolving tank. It is pretty neat!
Creating a demand without having a supply falls right in line with everything else MAC has done, everything backwards.
BTW, the Pittsburgh Zoo & Aquarium has installed a device which constantly cleans the glass on your revolving tank. It is pretty neat!
clarionreef
Advanced Reefer
- Location
- San Francisco
Selling certification schemes to the Nemo children?
Why not? A power bloc of dedicated and consciencious 9 year old pre- hobbyists might embrace a certification movement with no fish supply to back it up where professionals would not.
Putting the cart before the horse on this may have been one of the admitted mistakes...but keeping the cart before the horse is a current and present mistake.
Pushing demand for something that you cannot deliver is illogical and sets up people, especially supporters, for a big let down.
The list of former MAC supporters and current detractors is as long as the lines at the Nemo grand opening. The refusal to front load field concerns and go doggedly plugging away at "creating demand first" in the market countries is a failed, theoretical strategy that is not making progress. In this trade, its hard enough to sell fish in front of the customer, let alone fish that don't exist yet.
Pushing lofty concept over substance and supply to the cheap fish mass public or mail order public in a depressed economy is an exercise in futility...certified and guaranteed.
Obviously there must be a secret plan to train masses of net collecting divers quickly because there sure is no working understanding anymore with CORL to do the job for/with MAC.
If this is wrong, MAC can correct it for us but as of last nite...the accord is falling apart from mutual dis- interest in working with each other. The heads of both groups...they are not even talking.
I relize that other strange and exotic strategies may be in the works among MAC thinkers but as of last nite, I can assure you that they are going no where with CORL and therefore its training teams.
TROLLING FOR FRIENDS AT THE NEMO OPENINGS MAY BE THE BEST PLACE TO FIND SUPPORT now for MAC cause it has blown every chance to get on board with those it most needed to create a bonfide supply of netcaught fish to go with all its theory.
Sincerely, Steve Robinson
CORL field hand
Why not? A power bloc of dedicated and consciencious 9 year old pre- hobbyists might embrace a certification movement with no fish supply to back it up where professionals would not.
Putting the cart before the horse on this may have been one of the admitted mistakes...but keeping the cart before the horse is a current and present mistake.
Pushing demand for something that you cannot deliver is illogical and sets up people, especially supporters, for a big let down.
The list of former MAC supporters and current detractors is as long as the lines at the Nemo grand opening. The refusal to front load field concerns and go doggedly plugging away at "creating demand first" in the market countries is a failed, theoretical strategy that is not making progress. In this trade, its hard enough to sell fish in front of the customer, let alone fish that don't exist yet.
Pushing lofty concept over substance and supply to the cheap fish mass public or mail order public in a depressed economy is an exercise in futility...certified and guaranteed.
Obviously there must be a secret plan to train masses of net collecting divers quickly because there sure is no working understanding anymore with CORL to do the job for/with MAC.
If this is wrong, MAC can correct it for us but as of last nite...the accord is falling apart from mutual dis- interest in working with each other. The heads of both groups...they are not even talking.
I relize that other strange and exotic strategies may be in the works among MAC thinkers but as of last nite, I can assure you that they are going no where with CORL and therefore its training teams.
TROLLING FOR FRIENDS AT THE NEMO OPENINGS MAY BE THE BEST PLACE TO FIND SUPPORT now for MAC cause it has blown every chance to get on board with those it most needed to create a bonfide supply of netcaught fish to go with all its theory.
Sincerely, Steve Robinson
CORL field hand
vitz":2ppmbtqs said:Sardonic Wit":2ppmbtqs said:
no such thing ever happened :roll:
methinks you may want to change your handle to 'rumormongerer'
Had to do a search to figure it all out. Looks like you asked to have your screen name deactivated? Understand that from my perspective it looked like you were banned.
Don
P.S. I really wanted the screen name "MudSlinger" but it was already taken.
I have been saying all along that there was no way this "alliance" between MAC and CORL was ever going to happen. Even when Peter was trying to convince me that it was, I still stood firm and said "No way". Glad to see that everyone else has finally come around to the realization that MAC doesn't want to work with CORL, and in my opinion never intended to in the first place. By leading the CORL people into believing such folly, MAC again pulled their same, sad trick. "Here look, we're friends, we're going to work together and fix this problem. We want you on board. Now, let's all play nicely and keep it behind closed doors. No more public bashing from you rebellious CORL people, ok?". Steve, you played this game once at the LA wholesalers meeting. I know you're smarter than to ever make the mistake again. But hey, if you can't say you've been bamboozled by MAC then you must not be involved.
Lord knows I was. So now the "gloves are back off". We can speak openly and candidly about everything. Will CORL move ahead and do trainings? I guess that depends on funding, it's sure not from lack of dedication from the people involved. It will be interesting to see how this whole thing pans out in the months to come. Glad I have a ringside seat. clarionreef
Advanced Reefer
- Location
- San Francisco
But Mary,
Unlike the behind closed doors meeting among L.A. importers, this one played out more in public. Its been a half a year since the accord was considered and that was a half a year of incredibily slow progress compared to what there could have been with better leadership and communication among leaders. But...the honeymoon can't last forever. At least one can say...and has to say...we tried.
MACs leadership is cold, indifferent and out of touch with reality. Nor are they making headway. To ruin the chance for peace and the final chance at IMAC made it official...this dog does not hunt. They do not engage. They do not communicate well and they do not learn. So...they will fall by the wayside as did the IMA...WASTED, SQUANDERED TIME, ENERGY AND MONEY.
Not all of us have the luxury to be ineffective at work. Most of us have to produce or perish. Trainers need to know if they're going to train or not. The waste of time between CORL and MAC will no longer figure in the equation. They cannot train, they have no funding for contracting out to CORL and they appear to have no interest in dealing with CORL ON any of this. So, we must move on...
Its not enough to know this in private...it must be known in public so everyone doesn't ask..."Well, did you give them a chance?"
Yes, AND A half a year is up and nothing is happening. That was plenty of time. No need to waste any more.
We will begin training soon and the task is to have a great deal of achievement and conversions and tape and photos to show at MACNA.
Steve Robinson
CORL trainer
Unlike the behind closed doors meeting among L.A. importers, this one played out more in public. Its been a half a year since the accord was considered and that was a half a year of incredibily slow progress compared to what there could have been with better leadership and communication among leaders. But...the honeymoon can't last forever. At least one can say...and has to say...we tried.
MACs leadership is cold, indifferent and out of touch with reality. Nor are they making headway. To ruin the chance for peace and the final chance at IMAC made it official...this dog does not hunt. They do not engage. They do not communicate well and they do not learn. So...they will fall by the wayside as did the IMA...WASTED, SQUANDERED TIME, ENERGY AND MONEY.
Not all of us have the luxury to be ineffective at work. Most of us have to produce or perish. Trainers need to know if they're going to train or not. The waste of time between CORL and MAC will no longer figure in the equation. They cannot train, they have no funding for contracting out to CORL and they appear to have no interest in dealing with CORL ON any of this. So, we must move on...
Its not enough to know this in private...it must be known in public so everyone doesn't ask..."Well, did you give them a chance?"
Yes, AND A half a year is up and nothing is happening. That was plenty of time. No need to waste any more.
We will begin training soon and the task is to have a great deal of achievement and conversions and tape and photos to show at MACNA.
Steve Robinson
CORL trainer
clarionreef
Advanced Reefer
- Location
- San Francisco
Mike,
Naesco doesn't care about that,
He wants his feel good fix and all things made right easily, friendly and cost free. He is indeed the anti Kalk...all positive vibrations and "can- do" spirit. I'd like to see more of that applied to something real though.
Naesco, ante up for the AMDA NET TRAINING FUND! And do something, anything for a change.
Steve
Naesco doesn't care about that,
He wants his feel good fix and all things made right easily, friendly and cost free. He is indeed the anti Kalk...all positive vibrations and "can- do" spirit. I'd like to see more of that applied to something real though.
Naesco, ante up for the AMDA NET TRAINING FUND! And do something, anything for a change.
Steve
cortez marine":1isdlw63 said:
"I'm in for fifty..Canadian.
"He is indeed the anti Kalk....all positive vibrations and can-do spirit"
Thanks Steve
Every day at every opportunity on three boards I fully support your efforts on the cyanide issue.
When I read newbies repeating in their own words what those who support the anti-cyanide movement are also posting, I know it is having some effect. But in order for us to be successful we need fish.
My post was meant to encourage you in the training side of the industry to move quickly.
Find the money, get on the plane and do it.
then there's this:
http://petsolutions.com/cgi-bin/cgiitml ... 000000&l=1
http://www.nano-reef.com/forums/showthr ... adid=12784
i wonder how much damage this nemo crap is gonna cause?
links provided by some folks on #reefs, and #reefcentral
http://petsolutions.com/cgi-bin/cgiitml ... 000000&l=1
http://www.nano-reef.com/forums/showthr ... adid=12784
i wonder how much damage this nemo crap is gonna cause?
links provided by some folks on #reefs, and #reefcentral
clarionreef
Advanced Reefer
- Location
- San Francisco
Vitz,
You ask how much damage this Nemo marketing movement is going to cause?
A great deal...not in business but out on the reefs.
The damage inflicted on healthy reefs by the cyanide trade was already bad enough to give rise to "placebo groups" like the IMA and MAC.
Now...with the increase in demand for Dory's ie. blue tangs, the cyanide damage to healthier reef habitat will intensify.
Unknown to Disney of course is the fact that most blue tangs in the Philippines and Indonesia are caught with the juice. Now more than normal market level quantities will be produced...perhaps a great deal more. The critical habitat damage to Dorys homelands will accelerate.
Yes there a some, repeat some ...netcaught ones coming in from non MAC sources in the Philippines and some from Vanuatu and the Solomon Islands. This is a small %. MAC sources of course do not get blue tangs as they only work in 2 areas where there are scant amounts left.
Blue tangs are indicator species in more ways than one.
1. They indicate by their presence wether or not reefs have been cashed in. Badly woked reefs = no more blue tangs.
2. They indicate wether or not your are "conventional" wholesaler. The netcaught people rarely have them as they are constrained by their own sense of morality...leaving the cyanide trade to market them freely.
3] They indicate wether or not a training program is sincere. The repeated lack of training for their legal production insures that the reform dealers will be handicapped continually, giving aid and comfort to the cyanide trade...a net negative in fact.
NEMO is here. The netcaught and/or certified supply is not. They will be wiped out now in huge numbers as their critical acropora and pocillapora habitats are burnt and poisoned across all South East Asia to come up with the demand. Big ticket department stores and e-tailers are salivating and grabbing all the supply they can corner. 'Desktop' aquarium sales will soar! The fever will build and catch fire for a few months...perhaps even slowing the onset of the summer slow season a bit.
And all over blue tang collecting areas, more coral heads than usual will start rotting off their tissues. Snotty mucous trails will be in evidence everywhere...indicating that Nemo was there.
We should've trained enough divers by now. We should've. We could've. But we didn't. This is the damage caused by phoney, incompetent and incomplete trainings by NGO groups that need to move aside. This is the source of my own anger.
Real professional,commercial collector training needs to go forth for a change. A CORL/AMDA accord is on the table. Netting has been funded. This is the summer is must get done.
Sincerely, Steve Robinson
Corl, AMDA, Cortez
You ask how much damage this Nemo marketing movement is going to cause?
A great deal...not in business but out on the reefs.
The damage inflicted on healthy reefs by the cyanide trade was already bad enough to give rise to "placebo groups" like the IMA and MAC.
Now...with the increase in demand for Dory's ie. blue tangs, the cyanide damage to healthier reef habitat will intensify.
Unknown to Disney of course is the fact that most blue tangs in the Philippines and Indonesia are caught with the juice. Now more than normal market level quantities will be produced...perhaps a great deal more. The critical habitat damage to Dorys homelands will accelerate.
Yes there a some, repeat some ...netcaught ones coming in from non MAC sources in the Philippines and some from Vanuatu and the Solomon Islands. This is a small %. MAC sources of course do not get blue tangs as they only work in 2 areas where there are scant amounts left.
Blue tangs are indicator species in more ways than one.
1. They indicate by their presence wether or not reefs have been cashed in. Badly woked reefs = no more blue tangs.
2. They indicate wether or not your are "conventional" wholesaler. The netcaught people rarely have them as they are constrained by their own sense of morality...leaving the cyanide trade to market them freely.
3] They indicate wether or not a training program is sincere. The repeated lack of training for their legal production insures that the reform dealers will be handicapped continually, giving aid and comfort to the cyanide trade...a net negative in fact.
NEMO is here. The netcaught and/or certified supply is not. They will be wiped out now in huge numbers as their critical acropora and pocillapora habitats are burnt and poisoned across all South East Asia to come up with the demand. Big ticket department stores and e-tailers are salivating and grabbing all the supply they can corner. 'Desktop' aquarium sales will soar! The fever will build and catch fire for a few months...perhaps even slowing the onset of the summer slow season a bit.
And all over blue tang collecting areas, more coral heads than usual will start rotting off their tissues. Snotty mucous trails will be in evidence everywhere...indicating that Nemo was there.
We should've trained enough divers by now. We should've. We could've. But we didn't. This is the damage caused by phoney, incompetent and incomplete trainings by NGO groups that need to move aside. This is the source of my own anger.
Real professional,commercial collector training needs to go forth for a change. A CORL/AMDA accord is on the table. Netting has been funded. This is the summer is must get done.
Sincerely, Steve Robinson
Corl, AMDA, Cortez
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