[jhale]

water changes. good skimmer. water changes. siphon crap out. water changes. water changes = my formula.

I have a BB, but this would work with a DSB as well. Just do more water changes [img]smile.gif[/img]

new water is the best filter. I read that somewhere.

[nanoreefer22]

Imagine what a huge skimmer, BB, and big water changes would do. That seems like the formula for a nice tank. If you can you can get all the other toys too.

Now I'm rethinking a SB. Someone help me decide.

Night everyone
-Kris

[FastUno]

Okay, now you guys have summoned the lister in me!

-Very small or relatively little fish
-Weekly siphoning accompanied by water changes
-Running carbon & some type of phosphate removal in a 1 micron filter sock, which you change at least weekly.
-Not overfeeding
-Not leaving your lights on too long
-Overskimming & cleaning out your skimmer neck at least every 2-3 days
-Adding some pretty clams
-Plenty of flow in your tank
-Not adding a fuge, unless you have to feed your tank & you should set it up so that the water is pre-filtered before it enters the fuge, or else you get crap build-up.
-Praying that we do not have another black out, like we did 2 years ago...what the heck did you guys do?

[ShaunW]

Alot of ideas, have been passed around here! I hope that I can add my 2c, [img]smile.gif[/img] .

DSB accumulate nitrate and phosphate and have a limited life span, BUT their benefit as a sink for these molecules are without question. However, after enough time has passed they represent a source of high nutrient leakage into the water column due to the bacterial populations changing over time. Jim's plan to remove a separate DSB from the main tank when this happens is a good strategy to get the best of both worlds. The "crud" in a DSB is bacteria!! not some exotic processed fish feces (say that fast 3X, ).

SSB (2cm or less) don't store nitrate and phosphate like DSB. With enough critters running around, dendritis gets eaten up and processed into smaller compounds to be skimmed out of the system.

BB is the best way to go for a extremely low nutrient environment (best for SPS systems, since SPS can synthesis all the amino acids requried for growth from photosynthesis).

Husbandry is the key to all these systems!!!!

Clams are NOT a source of nitrate of phosphate removal (they grow too slow)! and a good cleanup crew is a must for any reef tank (FastUno I am not trying to start an argument, just just give my 2c, [img]smile.gif[/img] )!

	SPS Small Polyped Scleractinians - Sometimes known as Small Polyped Stony corals. These are hard corals that have extremely small polyps. They are typically on the difficult side and require Metal Halide lighting or dense Power Compact or T5 arrays. These corals are prized for their rareness and ability to be easily fragged into multiple colonies.

[jhale]

I think we need more arguments on MR, it's too boring.

jk. I saw a thread on RC where someone detailed the amount of nitrates a clam would remove from the water. It was not that much. Now if you had a tank full of clams in line with your display tank, that might make a dent in the system. of course this depends on how much water were talking about compared to how many clams and their sizes.

	Manhattan Reefs Manhattan Reefs, the best aquarium community on Planet Earth!

[GQ22]

wow, this is great feed back. i definitely want to keep a low nutrient system. i have a good aqua c urhin pro with a mag 7 and it yields about 2 cups of skimmate a day. im going to use a combination of jackson anad fast uno approach. i like uno's idea about the clams. the description of the phytoplanton and clam in a bucket was pretty good = ) So bare bottom, calupera, clams, skimming, and siphoning out bb dietrus, im going to put a mound of rock in my bb though as i do want pods to grow and feed the tank. i remembered see john's tank during the frag swap and the amount of pods in there with no predators. that was pretty cool.

[spykes]

sometimes i have no idea about these things, because len from reefs.org has kepted his DSB for 10 years + and his tanks is beautiful....
http://www.reefscapes.net/120gallon.html
his cleanup crew has various nassurus and tiger cukes.

his tank is a SPS dominate tank so i have no idea. 10 years is a long time.

	SPS Small Polyped Scleractinians - Sometimes known as Small Polyped Stony corals. These are hard corals that have extremely small polyps. They are typically on the difficult side and require Metal Halide lighting or dense Power Compact or T5 arrays. These corals are prized for their rareness and ability to be easily fragged into multiple colonies.

[marrone]

DSB work but you need to have the right critters to make sure the sand bed is working correctly. There are alot of people running tanks for many years with DSB and have no problems. It all works you just need to choose the right setup for yourself.

A skimmer is a great tool but if your pulling stuff out like crazy everyday then you probably need to do more water changes, unless your tank is overload with things and you feed like crazy. Good water changes will really help a system.

The thing about clams is you need to make sure your water condition are very good and your lighting setup is correct. If not all your clams will died and then you'll really have problems. I think most people that add clams only do so after their system have been running for a while and they feel that they're ready to add a clam to their system. I don't think you want to add a clam to a system that isn't running well and hope it will make your system better.

[alrha]

using my system i have ~0 nitrates and ~0 phosphates

[FastUno]

Not to worry about any arguments or wars, besides I am feeling a little dark this week for I have seen Star Wars Ep3.

I have a little secret to tell...after I trade/buy that frag from you I just might test your water. I have not come across a single tank that has a 0 count for nitrates/nitrites. The most successful tank that I have seen, being able to keep ANY type of coral (including carnations), had a 50ppm nitrate count. I can't even figure that one out.

As far as clean up crew goes, I see most of my snails on the tank walls. Guess what? With all these snails I still have to clean the glass. My back glass wall is all green, because my T5's are so darn efficient in putting out light. I have never cleaned the back tank wall & the critters have not managed to put a dent in the growth. If I don't clean the front or sides of the glass, same thing. Growth overtakes what they are unable to consume. If anything they may help the rockwork keep slightly clean, but I don't see them that often on the rocks. A majority of them, the majority of the time, are on the glass. Just based upon the glass observations leads me to say, "what the heck are they good for?", except for maybe poop contribution.

With my clam observation (if you don't believe me try it yourself), seems like they definitely filter the water. I don't see them as CONSUMING nitrates or nitrites, or even converting them. I see them as consuming micro living cells & particles that are suspended in your water column. As a result this has an indirect affect on NO2 & NO3 build up.

On SB's, I have seen some great looking SB's from MR'ers. I have never inquired as to why or how. Shall we start naming names?

	Manhattan Reefs Manhattan Reefs, the best aquarium community on Planet Earth!