Mysterious Tang Demise

[esmithiii]

I have lost the third tank in a year. This one was introduced on the 4th of May and was eating, active and looked good this morning. I did a 20% water change this morning and noticed the tank in a crevice in the live rock "breathing hard." The other tank mates (tomatoe clown, 2 damsels) all look great. All the corals look great too.

I did change one of the two pc bulbs in the tank. I went from a normal 55W bulb to a smartlight 65W bulb which is 10,000 on one side, actinic on the other.

Last time I checked the parameters (a week or so ago) they were as follows:

Ammonia 0ppm
Nitrite 0ppm
nitrate 25ppm
pH 8.2
Ca 400ppm

I aerated the water with a powerhead all night and matched the salinity and temp. I used RO water to mix the salt.

The last yellow tang was added in January and died in April

All the other tank mates have been in the tank since the beginning except one of the damsels.

Tank is 18 months old.

IDEAS?!??

Thanks,
E

 

[esmithiii]

correction: I just looked through my reef-journal and read that the last tang was added in September (not january) of last year and died in April.

E

 

[Anonymous]

What species of Tang are you having problems with ?
What are you feeding the Tangs and how often ?
What types of Damsels ?
What size tank ?


Regards,
David Mohr

 

[esmithiii]

David,

Yellow tang (Zebrasoma flavescens)
Brine Shrimp plus (1 cube/day for whole tank)
Emerald Entre (2 cubes/week)

1 yellow-tail damsel (Chromis xanthurus)
1 Yellow (not sure of scientific name)

55 Gal w/18 gal sump

Thanks
E

 

[naesco]

David your tank is too small for a tang. They need tanks starting at aroung 100 gals so that they can swim freely which is what they do in nature.
All the added things, water and light changed just added to the problem already created.
Please do not attempt further tangs until you can provide an environment where they can survive.

 

[Anonymous]

Do you have any macro-algae in the tank for the Yellow Tang to graze on ?
I don't want to sound harsh but IMO they're starving to death.
Tangs eat all day long in the wild not just algae but what ever small crustaceans it can pick off the rock as they are omnivores.
I'd feed at least 2 or 3 times a day, Nori, shreds of shrimp, squid, mussels, brineshrimp and other frozen preparations for herbivores.

Regards,
David Mohr

 

[esmithiii]

Also forgot to add: 1 small sheet of dried seaweed/week

Ernie

 

[Anonymous]

Originally posted by esmithiii:
Also forgot to add: 1 small sheet of dried seaweed/week

That's not enough.
See my post above.

Regards,
David Mohr

 

[esmithiii]

Thanks david. I have sporadically fed cuttings from the caulerpa in my sump but read recently that caulerpa has little nutritional value.

Do you soak your food in selecon or garlic?

When/if I add another tang I will up the frequency of the feedings, and add the dried seaweed as it is consumed.

I will be changing tanks (to a 180G- the stand is being built) in December and will probably wait until it cycles to add any fish.

Could you be more specific with regards to quantity and frequency of feedings?

Thanks in advance,

E

 

[Jeff Hood]

My yellow tang eats that much in a couple of hours. I put in at least one strip of dried algae a day every day sometimes two. I try to make sure there is some there at all times for grazing. The Tang also eats with the other fish.
Look at the abdomen. is it caved in or very bumpy? It should look full and round. the flesh on the side of the fish should be full and fat not caved in. I have seen many tangs sold in the LFS that are already starving and may even be beyond help. SAD

Jeff

 

[Anonymous]

Originally posted by esmithiii:
I have sporadically fed cuttings from the caulerpa in my sump but read recently that caulerpa has little nutritional value.

Many Tangs won't touch the stuff.

Do you soak your food in selecon or garlic?

Yup, all foods soaked in Selco/Selcon, Personally I don't use garlic.

When/if I add another tang I will up the frequency of the feedings, and add the dried seaweed as it is consumed.

Sounds good but remember it grazes all day long.

I will be changing tanks (to a 180G- the stand is being built) in December and will probably wait until it cycles to add any fish.

That's a good idea, I'd wait about 4 to 6 months but I err' on the side of caution.

Could you be more specific with regards to quantity and frequency of feedings?

In the wild Tangs are fat not thin like the pics you see of them in books. IMO they are little pigs as they will sample though maybe not eat everything.
A healthy Tang like I said grazes all day long on algae and small crustaceans, the best we can do is supply them with macro-algae to graze on or sheets of Nori during the day to graze on. Feed small shreds of squid, shrimp, mussels, frozen preparations, etc. all they can consume in about 2 minutes 2 or 3 times a day.
Remember a fat Tang is a healthy Tang.

Regards,
David Mohr

 

[Stars360]

naesco,

i will have to dissagree w/ that statement that all tangs need at least 100 gallons of water. the requirement is not the gallons of water but the area that the tangs can swim in. that is like me telling you that i have a 100 gallon hex tank (unrealisticly) and the dimmensions are 2' wide by 6' tall. do you think a tang would be happy in that. the min. requirement for a yellow tang is a 4' long tank, and bingo that is what a 55g tank is.

Calurpa does have nutritional value, it should be available for the tang to graze on 24/7. tangs (well most of them) are herbiverious fish, which means they will graze on plant like material all of the time...just my .02

brian

 

[Quillen]

I have sucessfully kept tangs in my 40, while small, and passed them on to a slightly larger tank when needed. I got the idea after seeing a curator of a salt water display having three tiny (tank raised) flagtail tangs in a 10 gallon tank. They look to have pleanty of swimming room for their size and are still in the tank.
Everyone has their own experiences

.

 

[esmithiii]

Thanks again, David.

E

 

[naesco]

Brian
You are absolutely correct the gallonage is not the important thing. It is the distance that a tang can swim.

However four feet long is not enough and therefore a 50 gallon in too small.
All you have to do is go see a large tank and observe the tangs swimming to appreciate this.
Tangs will survive in smaller tanks. The question is is the right thing to do?
IMO it is clearly not.
Thank you.

 

[esmithiii]

Brian (Naesco):

I truly appreciate the input. I am here to learn from other's experiences. One question, though: where do you get your information? is it personal experience? I really want to make an informed decision on wether to try another tang before the tank upgrade or not.

Anyone else w/ information?

Thanks again,
Ernie

 

[naesco]

First of all you have your own experience. You have had 3 yellow tangs die in your tank.
I have tried on two occasions to keep a clown tang and each time eventually they died. I will not keep another.

Secondly, use your moral judgement. You can keep a tang in a small tank but is it the right thing to do considering the need for the fish to swim. IMO A small tank filled with 'playmates' and rock does not meet the test.

Thirdly read!
Lipstick tangs (Naso) must have brown algae.
Achilles tangs very turbulent water.
Tangs generally;
"Yellow tang should be given plenty of swimming space. Smaller than 4 feet is probably too confining. Five specimens together in a 6 foot display would be appropriate." all from John Tullock.

Fourthly, the member experiences on this board.
Most of the fish problems on this board relate to putting too many in too quickly and inappropriate species for the size of the tank.
Most of the advice is personal experience, personal ethics, but the common desire is to have the new reefer succeed.
Some have truly had excellent success with difficult fish on the first try, but in my opinion this occurs rarely.
Ultimately, you are the keeper.

 

[esmithiii]

Naesco,

Thanks for the info. I will probably follow Tullock's advice (a fellow Knoxvillian, who used to own the store where I got the tang) and not put a yellow tang in a tank "smaller than 4 feet." Fortunately my tank is 4' long. As to my own experience, I am convinced now that the issue was the feeding regime. I am not convinced that the tank size is the issue.

I will probably wait until I upgrade the tank to add any fish...

Thanks again for the advice.

Ernie

 

[Cruiser]

Ernie

I would have to agree with "DavidMohr", that the tangs you have tried to keep are starving to death. As he mentioned, tangs are constant eating machines

. I'm willing to bet that (if you can remember - this is not a flame!) the tangs body area behind the head slowly became thinner and thinner over time?(this is a large problem with tangs, and other SW fish caught / shipped to suppliers then to LFS, that I have seen over decades in this industry

).

In the wild, they generally feed in the morning & evenings away from the reef at plant beds, and then constantly on the reef all day, picking at algae / microcrustaceans.

Generally, I feed my tangs anything & everything

, all day long - or when I'm viewing the tank, all critters get to eat!

Good luck and don't be afraid to try another
tang. Try and stay with some of the easier tangs (even though they are all fairly hardy / easy to care for) to start, and enjoy!

Joe

 

[Cruiser]

Brian (naesco)

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote

I have tried on two occasions to keep a clown tang and each time eventually they died. I will not keep another.

The clown tang is one of the harder tangs to
maintain in a aquarium. This could be a reason that you have had terrible experiences with tangs.

Using available "swimming space" as the determining factor will rule out about 95%
of the species we keep in our tanks

.
(of course I'm not saying to keep a 12" fish in a 10g tank).

I WILL probably get FLAMED for this statement -> but, tangs CAN be kept in our aquariums without problems related to water volume.

I have kept numerous tang species thoughout the years in a variety of tank sizes, with no ill affects to any of the tangs due to tank volume.

Currently have a Sohal Tang in a 20 gallon tank

. He will spend about 2 to 3 months in this tank during quarantine (mainly to remove internal parasites - worms). He is the dominant inhabitant of the tank. He is about 2" long, full color for a juvenile, and is a pig

You should try to maintain another tang,
probably an easier species then the clown, and you would be surprised how easy they are to maintain, and one of the best algae controlling fish available for reefs or saltwater tanks.

Joe