Moorish Idols

[Anonymous]

I am well aware of the strong opposition to keeping Idols in captive systems and their notoriously high mortality rate. I have been scathing in the past to people here who threaten to try and keep them.

I was at a friend's house the other day and he has 4 in a 5 foot tank. When I launched into a tirade about their survivability, he laughed at me- they are all residents there for over 3 years! He is pretty knowledgeable and catches his own specimens- M/Idols are very common on our coastline, and his are all personally caught. He has also given many caught specimens to other people in the hobby and has had no history of abnormal problems.

His trick is to catch locally, thus avoiding transportation stress, to quaranteen and to feed the typical food he feeds his tank for 3/4 days. At that point, they are either eating normally and happily, or he returns them to the ocean.

I know this is a controvertial subject, and I was interested in your comments. They are lovely fish, and if it is indeed possible to keep them, with high survivability, then why not?

 

[Anonymous]

When I had my 300, I was looking to eventually get an idol. But I wasn't going to just order one on-line. I was waiting for the opportunity to get one of the rare ones that have been kept for several years in someone's tank. I was waiting for the "tank's got to go, breakdown sale".

But I took the 300 down before that ever happened.

I'd try to get one if I were you, Andy.

Louey

 

[Anonymous]

If all those other aspects are satisfied, then yes, why not?

 

[Len]

If you can collect locally, it might make a world of difference. The stress of collection and transport could very well result in their poor captivity track record. But your friend could have just gotten lucky too. There are Idols that adjust to captivity (just as there are Regal angels that do), but the vast majority do not. Some times they will feed well for months, then go on a hunger strike for no reason and wither away.

Be aware they aren't totally reef safe. They're like butterflies and angels ... they are most likely to pick on some inverts. What inverts they are attracted to and how much they attack them depends on their individual personalities.

 

[Anonymous]

I would say try it. The only way to learn more about their care and behaviour is for people to give it a go. The only way I would say no is if the keeper is not totally committed to their care and survival.

 

[Anonymous]

Thanks for the comments!
Len, I think you hit the nail on the head about the local collection. That was my friend's point too. He believes that his success has to do with minimal capture/ transportation stress and the local rock/water/ climatic conditions we operate our tanks under. A large part of their diet is rock dwelling crustaceans (copepods) and sponges, something we are able to replicate pretty easily- my copepod population is already legendary and most of the small local sponges on the LR are growing well. When I rebuild my other tank (Hopefully in the next few days) I will be able to move the LR that is currrently being stored in that sump to the common sump, along with all that established life and live sand.

I think I will have a look at keeping a pair in the next few months, i want to see his four a bit further down the line and will make a decision based on his ongoing (hopefully) success.

 

[Anonymous]

There are quite a few species that would have better potential if it weren't for collection, post-collection housing and transportation stressors, IMO. For instance, I think green chromis would perform better overall if it weren't for these factors.

 

[Anonymous]

The Minnesnowta Zoo has kept a pair for going on 3 years now.

I think transport is a huge issue in the keeping of these fish. Ours were caught by a collector specifically for us. They spent minimal time in holding enclosures before they were shipped to us. As a result, they were still fat and happy when they got here. Getting them eating is key, and if you start with the best possible specimens, I think you've got a pretty good shot at keeping them long-term.

FYI, we don't feed them anything special. They get a gel diet (similar to Formula 1 or 2), and their diet is supplemented with krill, mysis, and chopped seafood.

There are however potential issues trying to keep these fish in a multi-species exhibit. They seem to be fairly territorial, and I've heard quite intolerant of their own species. But given a large enough enclosure (300-500g minimum) I don't think there are really serious issues getting them to thrive long-term.


Another thing to consider is the relative abundance of the fish in the wild. While snorkeling or diving in Hawaii I saw countless idols...I can't remember seeing a single yellow tang. So all things considered, I think that trying a Moorish Idol is better than maybe a Bangaii cardinal or a mandarin dragonet...

 

[Anonymous]

The Steinhart keeps one in what looks like an absolutely tiny tank (although in reality probably is over 100+ gallons)... but it is tiny in comparison to the fish.

Although I have to cringe whenever someone says "Try it"... likes its a snack and if it goes bad you can just spit it out.

 

[Anonymous]

The Steinhart keeps one in what looks like an absolutely tiny tank (although in reality probably is over 100+ gallons)... but it is tiny in comparison to the fish.

Although I have to cringe whenever someone says "Try it"... likes its a snack and if it goes bad you can just spit it out.

It's grown pretty big. That tank is a 36" cube (200g), and the MI shares it with some small cardinalfish, a pygmy angel, a mystery wrasse, and a sharpnosed toby. If it were a typical 200g reef tank with 5 tangs, an angelfish, and packed with rock and corals I'd absolutely agree with you about the size. I think one of the keys to these guys is minimizing chronic stress, which means not placing them in a tank with tangs, angels, etc. I think he's been with us for 3 years but I'm not positive. At least 2 years though.

IME it is not hard to get MIs eating right away on a variety of foods, and this is not the challenging part of keeping them at all.

 

[Anonymous]

The MI has been with us since I started being a vol...so thats like 2.5 years.

I agree with what has been said about collection. I am also of the opinion that acclimation to captive foods is important. You can't dump this kind of fish in with other voracious, territorial fish and expect it to thrive (unless you get it from Divers Den, but thats another story). I think they need a clam small place where they can be close to different foods without as Matt says, chronic stress. Either way, even acclimated, eating, MI's have been known to suddenly drop dead.

Andy, I say you give it a go and keep up with notes and pics for the rest of us.

 

[Anonymous]

Kay, I did it... let the flaming begin....

I put in a small locally caught specimen around a month ago- its thriving in my big tank, and eats like a horse. I will post some pics when I get enough time to take them. The tank has no antisocial species in it, and that helped i think. Its grown nicely in the month.

Still waiting to catch some Jem tangs for the main system.

 

[Ben1]

FLame Flame Flame lol j/k. Grats, hope he does well for ya! Your lucky to be able to catch your own fish, I wish I could do that. Gem tangs are awesome too, just way out of my price range.

 

[Anonymous]

I assume this is not the Volitans Lionfish and Moray? :wink:

We now have two threads where you owe us pics.

 

[Anonymous]

I know - I am out of town for the next 5 days, will take some when I get back and post them early next week.

 

[Anonymous]

I'm glad you got the Idol and it is eating well.

Now, the pictures please. :wink:

Louey

 

[Anonymous]

I know - I am out of town for the next 5 days, will take some when I get back and post them early next week.

You need to get your priorities in order-feeding everyone's tank envy addiction with adequate snaps takes precidence :wink:

 

[Anonymous]

As promised.....

 

[Anonymous]

8) Schweet! How about a FTS?

 

[Anonymous]

Heh, I've just added another thing to my list of reasons I envy Andy. That list is still balanced out by the list of reasons I don't of course (daily risk to life and limb, that sort of thing).