Tetra Products Boycott?

[naesco]

Moderator Comment: This new thread was started as a split from Letter To Paul Holthus.

MaryHM wrote:
Here's an interesting tid-bit:

The hobbyists are up in arms about the Early Show/Tetra fiasco. Way more up in arms about that than about cyanide use, but that's another story.... Anyway, some of them emailed MAC. They received responses from Sylvia Spaulding (PR person) and Mr. Holthus himself. Turn around time for a response? ONE DAY.


I am very disappointed to read this for a couple of reasons.

Both Sylvia and Mr. Holthus should be commended not criticized for offering to talk to Tetra about the major PR plunder they are suffering.

Secondly, it was the hobbyists who I believe within 3 days raised most of the money you requested to purchase nets for former cyanide-use fishers.

Naesco, here is why we are having problems in this forum. You are putting words in my mouth and then getting "disappointed" over your own incorrect assumptions.

First, I'm not criticizing MAC for offering to talk to Tetra. Where in the world did I mention or even imply that?? Check the post- I DIDN'T. I was pointing out the fact that it took them one day to respond to the hobbyists, but a month and a half to respond to me. I was criticizing them for taking so bloomin' long to address the issues I and others brought to their attention. Second, I am extremely appreciative of the hobbyists and industry people who contributed to the net fund. However, can you honestly tell me that hobbyists are more up in arms about cyanide use than they are about what Tetra did?? You don't see hobbyists emailing, calling, faxing, and demanding a boycott of companies supporting the cyanide trade. That was my point.

Yes I understand. It is sometimes difficult to get your point across when one has the constraints of a posting.
You must have had a bad hair day because your reply is not that helpful
IMO hobbyist are one hell of lot more concerned about cyanide than is industry. That is why you were so successful in your net collection fund which was my point.
Further how many here are boycotting Tetra?
Faxed, wrote or telephoned them?
Took the 10 seconds necessary to email them?

 

[MaryHM]

I emailed them.

 

[John_Brandt]

I support creating a dialogue with, and possibly educating, Tetra Public Relations. I do not support a boycott of Tetra products, or stores that sell them (as has been suggested on Reef Central).

 

[MaryHM]

I agree with John. I'm not in favor of a ban- especially the banning of stores that carry Tetra. I don't deal with Tetra anyway.

 

[naesco]

I support creating a dialogue with, and possibly educating, Tetra Public Relations. I do not support a boycott of Tetra products, or stores that sell them (as has been suggested on Reef Central).

John and Mary Why? Details please. Have you at least emailed your concerns.
At this point Tetra has ignored all efforts by hobbyists, industry in others who have asked for an apology and to have Tetra make amends.

 

[John_Brandt]

Wayne,

The gargantuan Tetra/CBS/Nemo thread on Reef Central is a perfect example of mass hysteria. There was (and still is) very little insight as to how to bring about the best results from a grassroots effort.

Five-gallon Nemo tanks don't materialize out of thin air. They would be primarily sold to children (and adults) by retailers. Why don't the teeming millions focus their efforts on making sure retailers don't sell the tank that Tetra demonstrated on CBS?

Why doesn't AMDA get its butt in gear and start a campaign to educate retailers on proper Nemo set-ups?

 

[naesco]

Wayne,

The gargantuan Tetra/CBS/Nemo thread on Reef Central is a perfect example of mass hysteria. There was (and still is) very little insight as to how to bring about the best results from a grassroots effort.

Five-gallon Nemo tanks don't materialize out of thin air. They would be primarily sold to children (and adults) by retailers. Why don't the teeming millions focus their efforts on making sure retailers don't sell the tank that Tetra demonstrated on CBS?

Why doesn't AMDA get its butt in gear and start a campaign to educate retailers on proper Nemo set-ups?

The answer to the question is that industry does not give a damn.

John you need to know that aside from the mass hysteria (I am so proud of my fellow hobbyists) other things are happening vis-a-vis Tetra.
Unfortuneately Tetra is not listening and not doing anything, thus, the boycott.
What would be most helpful at this stage is to have even more industry types contacting Tetra and thereby forcing them into something right, but, industry does not have the balls to do that. (There are some exceptions like www.aquariumsUSA.com , purveyors of fine aquariums.
For those of you who do not know, the thread has over 30,000 hits in less than 5 days. All outraged!! :evil:

pS thanks for moving the Tetra part here but it was Mary's fault for getting me going on this.

 

[MaryHM]

As stated, I already emailed them my concerns. I don't feel that boycotting Tetra at this point is going to do any good. The intent of the "mass hysteria" should have been trying to reach some type of agreement with them Tetra proper education, etc... Not to immediately put them on the defensive with screaming "boycott" within days of the thing happening. I emailed them about something positive they could do, but I fear the damage done by the screaming masses not even giving them a chance will prevent that from happening.

 

[naesco]

As stated, I already emailed them my concerns. I don't feel that boycotting Tetra at this point is going to do any good. The intent of the "mass hysteria" should have been trying to reach some type of agreement with them Tetra proper education, etc... Not to immediately put them on the defensive with screaming "boycott" within days of the thing happening. I emailed them about something positive they could do, but I fear the damage done by the screaming masses not even giving them a chance will prevent that from happening.

Mary and ethical and responsible Tetra woud do something. They havn't.
Thanks for emailing them and trying to help, though. Unfortuneately, they ignored everyone.

 

[MaryHM]

If you're anything, be consistent. That's my motto.

When did all of this happen?? A week ago?? I didn't see you giving up on MAC after a whole month and a half of not answering my concerns. Why does Tetra have to operate on a different timeline than MAC? Why are the Tetra concerns any more important than the MAC concerns?

 

[John_Brandt]

Boycotting was suggested within hours, not days. Wayne, it was not Tetra's inaction that prompted the boycott movement, it was the mentality of the masses.

I am personally ashamed of what has gone on. Forcing Tetra to do something is ugly, encouraging them to do so is a beautiful thing.

MAC will be engaging in calm, non-threatening dialogue with Tetra to try to arrive at effective and reasonable reparations for what has occured.

 

[Anonymous]

naesco wrote:

IMO hobbyist are one hell of lot more concerned about cyanide than is industry

.




:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


wrong- just take a look at the big outcry on the main forums on the boards-what percentage of posts started by hobbyists even mention cyanide?


most posts are more 'how do i take care of such and such after i bought it? :x

you just don't see things, do ya?

 

[naesco]

Boycotting was suggested within hours, not days. Wayne, it was not Tetra's inaction that prompted the boycott movement, it was the mentality of the masses.

I am personally ashamed of what has gone on. Forcing Tetra to do something is ugly, encouraging them to do so is a beautiful thing.

MAC will be engaging in calm, non-threatening dialogue with Tetra to try to arrive at effective and reasonable reparations for what has occured.

Not true at all John. We tryed everything including emailing suggestions, phoning the General Manager of the US operations, emailing the Chairman of the Supervisory Board in Germany, contacting industry to advise them of the upcoming storm of protest, and contacting others with the view of Tetra coming out of this in the best possible light.
Tetra did sweet ****all. That is the truth.

 

[naesco]

If you're anything, be consistent. That's my motto.

When did all of this happen?? A week ago?? I didn't see you giving up on MAC after a whole month and a half of not answering my concerns. Why does Tetra have to operate on a different timeline than MAC? Why are the Tetra concerns any more important than the MAC concerns?

Because the people who are screaming at them are their customers, Mary.

 

[John_Brandt]

Boycotting was suggested within hours, not days. Wayne, it was not Tetra's inaction that prompted the boycott movement, it was the mentality of the masses.

I am personally ashamed of what has gone on. Forcing Tetra to do something is ugly, encouraging them to do so is a beautiful thing.

MAC will be engaging in calm, non-threatening dialogue with Tetra to try to arrive at effective and reasonable reparations for what has occured.

Not true at all John. We tryed everything including emailing suggestions, phoning the General Manager of the US operations, emailing the Chairman of the Supervisory Board in Germany, contacting industry to advise them of the upcoming storm of protest, and contacting others with the view of Tetra coming out of this in the best possible light.
Tetra did sweet ****all. That is the truth.

Wayne, eat your words!

You were the very first person to call for a boycott in that thread on Reef Central. And you did so 2.25 hours after the very first posting about the program.

 

[John_Brandt]

What really annoys me about the RC boycott hysteria is that some jerk (on page 19) decided to suggest that MAC is behind a boycott of Tetra. That is BS!!!!

 

[naesco]

Boycotting was suggested within hours, not days. Wayne, it was not Tetra's inaction that prompted the boycott movement, it was the mentality of the masses.

I am personally ashamed of what has gone on. Forcing Tetra to do something is ugly, encouraging them to do so is a beautiful thing.

MAC will be engaging in calm, non-threatening dialogue with Tetra to try to arrive at effective and reasonable reparations for what has occured.

Not true at all John. We tryed everything including emailing suggestions, phoning the General Manager of the US operations, emailing the Chairman of the Supervisory Board in Germany, contacting industry to advise them of the upcoming storm of protest, and contacting others with the view of Tetra coming out of this in the best possible light.
Tetra did sweet ****all. That is the truth.

Wayne, eat your words!

You were the very first person to call for a boycott in that thread on Reef Central. And you did so 2.25 hours after the very first posting about the program.

You mean I started the boycott?
My mom is going to be so proud of me.
As some of you may know, putting a six inch regal tang in a five gallon tank just might get a little reaction out of me.

 

[clarionreef]

Disney, Pixar and Tetra,
They have all contributed to the cashing in on saltwater fish thru their attempts at simplifying and dumbing down the requirements of keeping saltwater fish.
They are not after nor trying to please the cutting edge of the trade.
They are not trying to please the competent part of the trade.
They're after the masses and have or attempted to apply the principals of mass marketing and industrial production to a work in progress.
Yes, we were hoping to reach [ and perhaps succeeding to a degree ] the conscience of our own industry. These assaults by less involved industrial players seek to include as many as possible into the trade. A trade based on "limited" wildcaught livestock that comes from reefs largely under siege.

They don't think like us here. They think of mass production as in dry goods and have simply ommited the restraints and limitations that dealing in massive amounts of wildlife involves.
Such is the corporate mentality.
Millions cannot as easily be generated by a trade 'soul searching' and trying to slow down and refom/humanize production as we want to do..
They have "discovered us". They have targeted the new hobbyists and beginners. Once the marketing plan is in place, all that needs to happen is the massive ramping up of production to meet it. Simple right? Simple if your a marketing, sales or office type unburdened by concerns over the ethics and implications of doing so.
You'll notice that our very own MAC has recognized the benefit potential in playing ball with these corporate movements. They are much preferred over dealing with real life marinelife dealers who want change..
Seeing how MAC embraced the massive middle from the outset ie. the Indonesian Assn, the Philiippine Assn and the LA Importers it is clear that they wanted to take it to the mass market and offered certification ie. absolution, for playing ball with them.
This was done at the expense of the "lunatic fringe" ie. true believers inreform. To this day they remain at increasing odds with the reforn wing.
This is disturbing to me as it suggests a MAC behaving like a chamber of commerce for the mass industry, proffering its own reform platform from inside the belly of the beast. A platform that worries not the beast at all. I know the beast. They joke of MACs ineptitude and long, long time line to do things. 'Plenty of time to delay til retirement' is a common joke. Plenty of time to continue as usual and perhaps get into something else.
No. The beast does not fear MAC at all. They get along with everybody except the ones most upset with the status quo. That is a bad
sign for any group pretending to reform anything.
Imagine whalers not fearing the Sea Shepards or the Rainbow Warriors. Imagine them not fearing Greenpeace...oops, wrong example, Greenpeace sold out and adopted non combative methods to not alienate the masses that they became popular with. Selling nature calendars and working within the whale killing system became their new M. O. Of courses this alienated the true believers and they left.
Greenpeace Inc. continues to milk the cow, I mean the whale and will continue to do so til the last one.
Sea Shepard, Rainbow Warriors...where are they now?
They didn't make money but they did save some whales.
Greenpeace? It just makes money. Whales continue to decline in most species from "scientific er, certified" whaling...as they aggressively sell their calendars and pitch memberships and go "mainstream.".
As foundation money dries up to fund NGOs we will see a shift to the corporate sector perhaps. This will mean an even less independant spirit and a more corporate compatible one. NGO refrom groups will increasingly become corporate public relations tools...you'll see.
Steve

 

[John_Brandt]

Wayne,

I know you work in metric measurements, but that blue tang that was placed into the demonstration tank on CBS was not 6". I would estimate it to have been 3-4 inches.

Now, before you say it Wayne, I know....Who cares how big it was? You don't put a blue tang in a 5 gallon tank.

 

[Nancy Swart]

Just found this on ReefCentral...

http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthrea ... ost1462990