John_B... - Where's MASNA on HR 4928?

[Anonymous]

GratefulDiver,

The notification to MASNA membership that John Brandt referred to (regarding the bill and a link to its text) was emailed this morning.

Personally, I'm waiting for John's report to the MASNA membership about the September USCRTF meeting before I write any congressional representatives. By the way, a significant portion of MASNA membership fees go directly towards sending hobbyist representation to USCRTF meetings and wholesaling that information to our membership.

Outstanding! - Thanks Lee!

 

[omegatron]

Mitch

MASNA stipulates in its MACNA contract that the host club MUST provide AMDA with a room for its meeting FREE OF CHARGE. We do this because we are not biased in any way and very supportive. As Lee suggest all organizations are treated the same. The majority of etailers I know of are very ETHICAL some of them being avid hobbyists who care about the livestock.

If anything MASNA sole concern is the ETHICAL practice of business concerning the care of MARINE ORGANISMS.

PS. I totally understand your point on why you do not like etailers.

However read below as I think it is much more than a price thing. Yes I will purchase equipment for lowest prices on internet as that is smart. However for most livestock I purchase local as a rule of thumb. I think however hobbyists do not buy from retail for the reasons below which have nothing to do with pricing.

As a hobbyist for many many years I do not think the majority of retail stores will be held high in hobbyists eyes till they change there ways of business. I know from your passion on the subject you are an ETHICAL store owner. I have a friend of mine who owns a store here in Maryland Exotic Aquatics named Phil. He is also very ethical. A customer can not come into his store and purchase corals and live rock in the same purchase etc. He truly cares for the animals he has and the success of the hobby.

However you know as any hobbyist does this is not the norm. There are a very small amount of store owners out there that are ETHICAL. My friends store is the only store in Maryland I would consider practices ETHICAL behavior and hense is the only store I buy from at a retail level. There are probally 50 stores that sell marine organisms statewide here maybe more. I have been to most of them. That is a lousy percentage and I think most hobbyists can agree as I have had many discussions with friends on this issue. A lot of hobbyists refuse to buy from local stores for the very reason of UNETHICAL PRACTICES.

As long as true hobbyists can go into RETAIL STORES and see them just caring about raking in money and giving false information to new hobbyists they will boycott that store. I have many many times seen loca business owners giving false information to customers and have pulled customers aside and given them correct information. It kills me when I see local retail stores allowing customer to walk out of their store with a box full of liverock and bags of fish and coral just for the sake of a buck.


Chuck Scannell
MASNA President

 

[Anonymous]

chuck

keep in mind that customer <>aquarist<>hobbyist

:wink:

a 1st time purchaser is usually NOT a hobbyist, and usually knows no better than to be taken advantage of

most pet stores/lfs's work via the 'slash and burn' model-get the initial killer sale, and don't care if the customer comes back

time and time again, the majority of customer's i've tried to talk out of purchasing things prove to me that price is indeed the central factor when purchasing items for 'aquarium keeping', whether it be dry goods, or livestock

go take a look at the bb's, the chat channels, and see how many issues are price related, when it comes to people choosing or recommending an etail/bricktailer to friends or themselves, or choosing livestock

 

[Anonymous]

oh- and where has there ever been a 'boycott' of ANY lfs?

even petco/petsmart has demonstrations near their store's premises occasionally, and last time i checked, they do killer business, even the really bad stores complained about on the bb's

the 'ethical hobbyist' represents MAYBE 1% of the general sw livestock buying population, ime

 

[dizzy]

PS. I totally understand your point on why you do not like etailers.

However read below as I think it is much more than a price thing. Yes I will purchase equipment for lowest prices on internet as that is smart. However for most livestock I purchase local as a rule of thumb. I think however hobbyists do not buy from retail for the reasons below which have nothing to do with pricing.

Chuck Scannell
MASNA President

Hi Chuck,
I'm not looking to pick a fight with MASNA as I belive it is a well meaning and worthwhile organization. I was simply a little surprised to see banner ads on a site such as yours. Seems like we are victims of marketing overload in this country. Telemarketers calling during the dinner hour and on Sundays. Spam filling up our inboxes. Bogus calls on stocktips at the work place. The newspaper and the mailbox full of junk mail. I get tired of being pitched too everywhere I look or go. I believe you when you say there are lots of bad stores on the East Coast. I believe Norm when he says most stores in Michigan are awful. I don't however believe the stores in the Mid-South are nearly so bad. We have several in Kentucky and Tennesse that are quite good. Sure some bad ones remain, but who really goes there and buys anything? Not many I suspect. Despite the fact that there are good stores, more and more people are looking to buy the discount supplies online. Every lfs in the country, no matter how good is losing business to the net. The big boxes and their weekly sales flyers take their slice of the pie too. When you factor in the threat of hr4928 and the MAMTI certification scheme, it spells very tough times for the average retailer. Even John Brandt might be willing to agree that there will not be enough certified livestock to go around for quite some time if ever. If the big boxes and the Fosters and Smiths of the world get certifed it will be check mate for most, as they use purchasing power muscle to hog up the limited fish and coral supply. As I read the MAC Quarterly reports and the MAMTI documents I see that Marine Aquarium clubs will be used to create a demand for a product that will be very limited in supply. Independent retailers and etailers alike will fall victim to the lack of variety these coming changes will bring. Even many hobbyists and members of aquarium clubs will be very disappointed when they can no longer keep many of the fishes and corals that are commonly offered for sale these days. Things like large polyp stony corals and blue face angels will no longer be available, except at great costs. I truly hope the genocide of independents and the downsizing of our industry saves the reefs, however I doubt it will since we are such a small part of the overall causes of reef decline. Now that's a pretty pessimistic look at where this might be leading us all from an independent retailer's perspective. I'm hoping that by offering up these gloomy predictions we can work out some type of compromises that prevents it all from coming true. There is no time like the present to get started thinking about these issues.
Mitch

 

[Anonymous]

I believe Norm when he says most stores in Michigan are awful.

Most? .. Yes. - All? .. No..

There are some nice ones.. On the overall, most of the bad apples are the all-round pet shops and not the reef-specialized. (Again.. - operative word there is "most"..) -- And this is probably true just about everywhere too.. Folks who setup general "pet shops" serving all types of pets more often than not don't appear have a full grasp of the needs of MOs.. Heck, even a couple "dedicated" shops I've seen (and not just in MI) don't hit the mark in having a solid idea of knowing what they're doing.

And I certainly haven't even come close to hitting all of the shops in MI yet either.. (I still need to make the journey to Tropicorium.. 8O )

 

[Anonymous]

I've said it many times. The saviour of the reefs and the hobby is to set up more independent retailers. Between us and Atlanta there are very few truly bad stores, and more good ones popping up all the time. Why? Competition. A bad store couldn't possibly open up in this area and survive for very long simply because of the sheer number of quality alternatives. A truly good store will raise the bar for all others. It will both keep people in the hobby and create new ones, thus generating much more interest in the reefs, reef ecology, and conservation. A simple website can't possbily do that. A big box store can't do that. And if hobbyists could step outside a see the bigger picture, they would see that too. It's a self fulfilling prophecy. The good stores don't sell the good equipment, because the internet beats them too it. A hobbyists can't get good equipment in the store because he buys it on the net.