MAC Certified Cultured Live Rock

[dizzy]

The reason Mary pulled off all that valuable info from her website was because Wayne would misquote the site and stuff she said to further his cause.

Chris how about supplying us with an example of what your talking about here. Who was Mary quoting as the expert on cyanide? Wayne must have posted something that put him on your radar screen.
Mitch

 

[naesco]

Wayne,
A number of us are friends and in contact w/ dreaded panel members of the US Coral Reef Task Force.
Drop Andy a line. [[email protected]] He's the most credible member of the panel regarding the trade.
Steve
ps. [but don't tell him I sent you.]

Thank you Steve but I already have his name and contact info.

Wayne Ryan

 

[clarionreef]

Well then,
You're in!
What more could there be then a name and number?
Steve

 

[naesco]

Well then,
You're in!
What more could there be then a name and number?
Steve

lol:

 

[Anonymous]

Running to Greenpeace and telling the WWF they should withdraw their support of MAC is both irresponsible and dangerous. Especially since THE LIST HASN'T EVEN BEEN DECIDED ON YET. I am seriously concerned about the idea of hobbyists running to some of the major organizations and causing an uproar over something that is still in the process of being worked on

Your dangerous Wayne, how many RDO mods need to tell you this?

 

[dizzy]

Wow,
Wayne and Mary both flip flopped on MAC in opposite directions. 8O

 

[Anonymous]

One thing Mary didn't ever flip flop on, was her opinion of Neasco (Wayne Ryan). Her post history reveals that blinding fact all to well

 

[midgetwaiter]

Naesco,

When I receive a shipment at the store how can I tell if the fish have been exposed to cyanide? HOW CAN I KNOW? I can't know, I can guess but that's about it. What the hell do you want me to do about this? How can I make a responsible purchase.

I'm going to give you some advice, it's probably going to be attributed as an attack by some but it isn't meant that way. I've seen the same stupid Tang fight get started by you on Canreef so many times, now every time you post there you get laughed at. I see the same patterns with what you are doing here, you need to step back and look at what you get out of it. This is not a substitute for real personal contact, I know it seems easier but it isn't the same thing. Talk to your doctor, see if he can recommend some counseling that will help, it should work very well as long as your meds keep you stable enough.

 

[Anonymous]

Sound advice. Many of us have tried to give similiar advice to him, but he doesn't listen

 

[Anonymous]

Wayne,

If you put your efforts, whatever they may be, into developing a useful juice test, and actually developed it, you would be my hero.

 

[Anonymous]

mine as well. Maybe you can join up with an expert, like Dr Peter Rubec?

 

[Caterham]

Its not surprising at all that one might be able to establish a pattern or trend with regards to a particular member who posts on this board. I can just imagine all of the folks laughing out loud as they read his posts on Canreef.

Please remember that some folks who post here have no involvement in the trade of marine ornamentals, past or present.

 

[naesco]

Wayne,

If you put your efforts, whatever they may be, into developing a useful juice test, and actually developed it, you would be my hero.

Than your hero will be the US Coral Reef Task Force because one of the things they deciided in their May meeting is that they will be certifying or approving a Cyanide Detection Test.

Once certiifed the CDT will be used tho prosecute those Americans who continue to deal in fish that they know or ought to have know were caught with cyanide.

Pretty good incentive to switch to a net caught supplier, eh!

Wayne

 

[Alembic14]

Wayne,

If you put your efforts, whatever they may be, into developing a useful juice test, and actually developed it, you would be my hero.

Than your hero will be the US Coral Reef Task Force because one of the things they deciided in their May meeting is that they will be certifying or approving a Cyanide Detection Test.

Once certiifed the CDT will be used tho prosecute those Americans who continue to deal in fish that they know or ought to have know were caught with cyanide.

Pretty good incentive to switch to a net caught supplier, eh!



Wayne

Wayne,
I closed my store almost three years ago, so I'm in the clear. But in the time I had the store, I dealt mainly with local wholesalers. During that time I tried to avoid Phillipine fish, but it was not reasonably possible to query the location of collection for every fish I ordered. Yes, I had livestock loss and yes, sometimes it seemed like they may have been juiced (refused live foods such as live prey items or macroalgae, depending on the particular feeding habit of the fish, hardened abdomen post mortem, etc.).

So you're saying that I should have been charged with a crime if a CDT had been available and used randomly in my shop, even though I had no complicity in the use of cyanide and lost money on that fish as well?

Just curious,
Stan

 

[Anonymous]

Wayne,

If you put your efforts, whatever they may be, into developing a useful juice test, and actually developed it, you would be my hero.

Than your hero will be the US Coral Reef Task Force because one of the things they deciided in their May meeting is that they will be certifying or approving a Cyanide Detection Test.

Once certiifed the CDT will be used tho prosecute those Americans who continue to deal in fish that they know or ought to have know were caught with cyanide.

Pretty good incentive to switch to a net caught supplier, eh!

Wayne

Geese Wayne. Without the test no one knows if the fish were juiced or not. How do you still not know that?

 

[naesco]

Wayne,

If you put your efforts, whatever they may be, into developing a useful juice test, and actually developed it, you would be my hero.

Than your hero will be the US Coral Reef Task Force because one of the things they deciided in their May meeting is that they will be certifying or approving a Cyanide Detection Test.

Once certiifed the CDT will be used tho prosecute those Americans who continue to deal in fish that they know or ought to have know were caught with cyanide.

Pretty good incentive to switch to a net caught supplier, eh!



Wayne

Wayne,
I closed my store almost three years ago, so I'm in the clear. But in the time I had the store, I dealt mainly with local wholesalers. During that time I tried to avoid Phillipine fish, but it was not reasonably possible to query the location of collection for every fish I ordered. Yes, I had livestock loss and yes, sometimes it seemed like they may have been juiced (refused live foods such as live prey items or macroalgae, depending on the particular feeding habit of the fish, hardened abdomen post mortem, etc.).

So you're saying that I should have been charged with a crime if a CDT had been available and used randomly in my shop, even though I had no complicity in the use of cyanide and lost money on that fish as well?

Just curious,
Stan

The enforcement of the Lacey Act which makes it a crime for those who know or ought to have known that the fish they purchased were caught with cyanide is a legal question.
There are wholesalers of fish from the Philippines and Indonesia who would certify them as net caught. I do not see any possibility of a LFS owner been charged with offences under the Lacey Act under the circumstances you mentioned.

IMO the first indictments for violation of the Lacey Act will be laid against wholesalers who make no effort to ascertain whether the fish they purchased were net caught.
In due course a judge will set the standard of care (legal precedent), and be assured the courts will show no mercy to those who make no effort to comply with the Law.
No reasonable person would risk their assets, livlihood and several hundred thousand of dollars in legal fees to be the first to be caught.

Any reasonable industry person, having read the minutes of the meeting of the US Reef Task Force in May would have to come to the conclusion that a Cyanide Detection Testing CDT in inevitable and that the Government will use the Lacey Act to enforce the law because it it right in the minutes of the May meeting.

Any reasonable industry person will have already taken steps by now to secure a supply of net caught fish.

A supplier today who claims their fish are net caught without any due diligence on their source and evidence to back up that claim is in deep doo doo.

 

[clarionreef]

Wayne,
The talk and the walk are still miles apart.
You should have linked up w/ Howard Latin.
He wanted to sue the big wholesalers for unfair trade practices as the illegal fish supply was an unfair advantage over the netcaught legal supply.
After convincing himself of the validity of the case....no one else was really convinced...and Eco-vitality fell apart for lack of consumer/dealer support.
The US Fish/wildlife service and the Canadian counterpart have no problem w/ cyanide fish and do not forsee any chance of a a CDT used to threaten anyone with. They routinely sign off on the incoming fish supplies as perfectly OK...every day.
The USCRTF stuff you cite as a foregone conclusion is not and being conclusive about dramatic and heavy handed coming events is not credible.
Celebrating a coming CDT is still premature. Its a notion...not a concrete plan.
If it were, importers would pay attention and perhaps be afraid.
They were once 4 years ago...but ceased to be when they all met with MAC and learned first hand how impotent it really was .
However, they struck a deal and saw a way to control MAC and have since let it handle the press, and giving it the validation it sought from the trade.

If you were sincere why would you not hold MAC more accountable for their long running history of mis-fires and mismanagement of the solution to the problem
Why?
Afraid?
Steve

 

[naesco]

[/quote]
If you were sincere why would you not hold MAC more accountable for their long running history of mis-fires and mismanagement of the solution to the problem
Why?
Afraid?
Steve[/quote]

It is very hard for me to be critical of those in industry and NGOs who are contributing something towards advancing reeform is the answer to your question.

Steve I have been critical of MAC. You recall MAC promised two years ago to make it a priority and that just has not materialized.
I am not aware of any progress that has been made by MAC on that front.

Many people as you are aware have been critical of you, but, I wish there were hundreds of you. Cyanide would have been a thing of the past>

Wayne Ryan

 

[Anonymous]

How did that USL you were so crazy for work out?

 

[clarionreef]

Wayne,
If the issues were not really more important than a shallow contest of affability and social grace...then by all means lets all hold hands and sing John Denver songs. :lol:

If the idea is to spark something and air issues and grieviences that are generally hidden...then thats what we can also do ...and hope it finds an audience.
You decide which appeals to you most.

If you go by gossip and rumor...in the search for meaning and purpose, then you base opinions on nothing.
Who has less flattering things to say then a competitor or the guilty?
Whistle blowers are by definition unpopular. Thats a given.
The search for solution is the crux of the matter now...and MAC has grabbed center stage and squanders the year after year that we had to get this thing straight.
Since they have actually taken a turn for the worse in terms of progress....it impells the sincere among us to call them on it and not hide from this inconvenient truth.
If you care, you must care to be effective...not just heard.
What do you want from stateside fish dealers when your own eco-reform groups are there where the action is...funded, salaried and ...and....engaging in malpractice. Like a mob lawyer, they are far more guilty then the dealers now.
Steve